Fat Noob needs starting advice

[TheGreatFatsby]

Big difference, I'm lighter on my feet and have had to get some new clothes for work. There are three of us in the team now too, so that will help. Are you always doing the same training, 12 minutes at same rate? If so, why not mix it up? I'm doing all sorts, but most often I plan my training to have a number of sets with rest periods of light rowing in between. For example, if you're aiming for 2,500 in 12 minutes, try doing something like 500m fast pace and 200m slow pace, 4 sets, total 2,800 meters. Mix it up, so to speak, for a week or more and then go back and try for 2500 in 12 minutes again. I'm really keen on the "work out of the day" suggestions on Concept2 website. That way I don't get in a rut doing easy sessions all of the time. I know what you mean about doing sessions at a different time, I start early so do mine after work, but on occasion through the March Madness Challenge I had some days with very early mornings, or late nights, so some days stayed up until after midnight to do that day's row before going to bed.
Wayne

I've only been on 12 minute sessions for the week. I started out in february only being able to do 6 min on the rower so I kept at that and added 1 min every 3 days until i got up to 10. I stayed at 10 for 2 weeks and then just started at 12.

That's a good idea mixing it up. I was doing a set session in the morning and then a 1000m time trial in the evenings but it was more than i could handle and my morning rows ended up being abysmal. I reduced the time trials to three times a week, then twice a week, but every time it was disastrous and right now im going to try M-F 12 min sessions and 1000m time trials on the weekends. If that can't work for me then I may try what you're doing there and I didn't even know about the daily workout, that's something I'll definitely check out, although I must say I have to yet to feel bored at all with my rowing.

Right now, I'm really just trying to get to a point where I can do 20-25 min sessions on the rower and still keep a split time of around 2:30 with a good, fast heart rate. As it stands now I can row about 3-4 minutes straight during my 12min and I have great speed and strokes/min but after that I start to slow and after about the 6 min mark I'm stopping every 60-80 seconds or so to catch my breath and cool my muscles which are normally on fire.

[wphunter]

Your body knows best, so listen to it and don't overdo it, but keep at it. That's what I have to keep telling myself.
Wayne

[shichtm]

I just wanted to say thank you to all the posters and their support and efforts. You guys inspire me.
As for the haters; nothing is more abhorrent than success to haters. They cannot stand it. Make them hate.

I'm 40 years old, 5'5" and 240 lbs. I do 30 min. and usually get around 6,500 meters keeping my stroke rate around 29 spm. to give you some sort of a bench mark. (its so hard to know how you are doing when you work out alone) But I am an "ex-athelete" so don't be intimidated. (if that is intimidating to begin with) I have noticed that in order to row around my belly i have to pull differently and it works your back more than I think it should; but there is nothing to be done about that. Also, because I am rowing around my belly I tend to push on the blades of my feet (the outside edge), so those of us that are rowing around our belly need to be cognizant of remembering to push with the ball of our feet, rather than the edge; which although I don't know with certianty I am sure will do something bad.
The only thing that I can constructive add without being repetitive is don't forget about stretching. I have noticed that rowing develops only vertical movements and promostes linear muscle memory. Make sure you do some dynamic stretching (twisting, sideways, etc.). Also, remember that rowing doesn't do anything for chest, so remember to sneak that in as well.

Its really nice to see a thread for the big boys; and girls, of course. Very refershing.

Keep at it everyone. You can do it!

[wphunter]

TGF, the team is now 72nd out of 146 teams!

[TheGreatFatsby]

I just wanted to say thank you to all the posters and their support and efforts. You guys inspire me.
As for the haters; nothing is more abhorrent than success to haters. They cannot stand it. Make them hate.

Hey thanks for posting! So great to see everyone here making steady progress. I know for me, personally, I was completely unable to relate to seeing some of the more accomplished rowers out there racking up such unbelievable numbers, so when I happened across here it put it into perspective and helped get me started to see others in a like situation.

This thread is really starting to pick up steam, hopefully if we keep it up we can get more and more people like us keep posting we can bring some more hefty beginning rowers out of the wood work.

I'm 40 years old, 5'5" and 240 lbs. I do 30 min. and usually get around 6,500 meters keeping my stroke rate around 29 spm. to give you some sort of a bench mark. (its so hard to know how you are doing when you work out alone) But I am an "ex-athelete" so don't be intimidated. (if that is intimidating to begin with) I have noticed that in order to row around my belly i have to pull differently and it works your back more than I think it should; but there is nothing to be done about that. Also, because I am rowing around my belly I tend to push on the blades of my feet (the outside edge), so those of us that are rowing around our belly need to be cognizant of remembering to push with the ball of our feet, rather than the edge; which although I don't know with certianty I am sure will do something bad.

Wow thanks for sharing some of your stats. Hopefully I can keep up a stroke rate like that sometime soon. The first half of my workout I can keep it in the 22-23spm range by as those minutes wear on I slowly drift below 20 and settle somewhere around 18.

TGF, the team is now 72nd out of 146 teams!

I just logged my meters and came right here to post this! Also looks like our team has ballooned to 4 members! I'm still bringing up the rear but I am proud to be doing my part. Top 50 here we come!

-----------------------------
Also happy report that I just logged my best row to date and for the first time ever I broke 2500 meters in one session! In fact, I logged 2598 in my morning 12 minutes, only 2 shy of 2600m! I felt better during this row than I ever have before, and took much less time catching my breath and cooling off than I have before and my split time was down to 2:18.5! Really excited to do a time trial tonite and see how much my speed has improved since last time.

Good luck everyone, and have a great week!

[Bob S.]

I'm 40 years old, 5'5" and 240 lbs. I do 30 min. and usually get around 6,500 meters keeping my stroke rate around 29 spm. to give you some sort of a bench mark.

Wow thanks for sharing some of your stats. Hopefully I can keep up a stroke rate like that sometime soon. The first half of my workout I can keep it in the 22-23spm range by as those minutes wear on I slowly drift below 20 and settle somewhere around 18.

TGF,

Stroke rate, high or low, is not any kind of useful goal. It is the rate of work done, i.e. the wattage, that counts and the work done is a combination of stroke rate and the work done per stroke. In turn the work done per stroke depends on the force exerted on the handle and the length of the stroke. The poster reports being 5'5". Shorter rowers, especially rowers with short limbs, will naturally use higher than average stroke rates, which makes up for having short stroke lengths. I don't remember your height - I didn't dig far enough back in the thread to see if you reported it, but my vague memory is that you were relatively tall. Another factor in determining stroke rate is the rower's weight. Higher stroke rates mean more lost (unmeasured that is) work done in accelerating the body up and down the slide. The heavier the rower, the more important this factor is. Of course, that applies to grounded rowing machines. Body movement on a dynamic erg or one on slides is a lot less.

Note that the Calorie value reported in the erg monitor takes that unmeasured energy into account - 300C/hr regardless of how much work is done on the wheel. Note also that the figure 300 is based on some sort of average of rower weight and stroke rate.

Bob S.

[TheGreatFatsby]

TGF,

Stroke rate, high or low, is not any kind of useful goal. It is the rate of work done, i.e. the wattage, that counts and the work done is a combination of stroke rate and the work done per stroke. In turn the work done per stroke depends on the force exerted on the handle and the length of the stroke. The poster reports being 5'5". Shorter rowers, especially rowers with short limbs, will naturally use higher than average stroke rates, which makes up for having short stroke lengths. I don't remember your height - I didn't dig far enough back in the thread to see if you reported it, but my vague memory is that you were relatively tall. Another factor in determining stroke rate is the rower's weight. Higher stroke rates mean more lost (unmeasured that is) work done in accelerating the body up and down the slide. The heavier the rower, the more important this factor is. Of course, that applies to grounded rowing machines. Body movement on a dynamic erg or one on slides is a lot less.

Note that the Calorie value reported in the erg monitor takes that unmeasured energy into account - 300C/hr regardless of how much work is done on the wheel. Note also that the figure 300 is based on some sort of average of rower weight and stroke rate.

Bob S.

Ahh okay.. well that makes perfect sense. I'm 6'1" and obviously a heavyweight. So you would say that tracking my watts rather than my SPM would be better? Right now I track my strokes per minute, average speed, and my average heart rate. I saw the wattage on there when I first started this, but its like handing me a wad of foreign currency.. i had no idea if it was high or low or what it good it did me at all.

[wphunter]

The logbook automatically has the distance, time, average/500m and date, so in the comments section I add what kind of workout I did and the calories burnt. I have progressed from 2:30/500m for my interval "easy" session down to 2:20/500m and have started programming the monitor so the calories from the interval section are recorded in the workout also. The calculator page (http://www.concept2.com/indoor-rowers/t ... calculator ) makes it very easy to work out the calories, but TGF being on a different rower, I'm not sure if you can use it or even what data your monitor provides. The best thing about calculating the calories, its great to be able to eat lunch and think, "I've burnt that off today", or at least part of it.
TGF, congrats on hitting your 2,500 goal!
shichtm, thanks for sharing, what you're saying makes sense. I have noticed though, and can happily report, as the weight comes down we're able to work on our form also. I still have a slight bow in the legs to make way for the belly, but its getting smaller.
Wayne

[Bob S.]

Ahh okay.. well that makes perfect sense. I'm 6'1" and obviously a heavyweight. So you would say that tracking my watts rather than my SPM would be better? Right now I track my strokes per minute, average speed, and my average heart rate. I saw the wattage on there when I first started this, but its like handing me a wad of foreign currency.. i had no idea if it was high or low or what it good it did me at all.

I had forgotten that you use a WaterRower rather than a C2, but was reminded of it by Wayne's post. The principles should be pretty much the same, but I have no idea how the WR determines the work done. That said, if it does give watts, you can use that to calculate other ways of expressing the work done. Wayne provided a link to the C2 calorie calculator. That same page also lists (on the left side) some other calculator options, pace and watts, in particular. Watts is the best way of expressing the rate of putting work into the wheel - a least from the point of view of a physicist or engineer, but most forumites use pace, which is the time for 500m. Sometimes that is called split time, based on the concept of a 2k divided into 4 splits. I hope that this is helpful, but I still wonder about how much difference there is with the WR. Does that company have a website that gives any indication of what sort of performances can be expected on their machine? That might be helpful for making a comparison.

Bob S.

[shichtm]

I think Bob S. has some worthwhile advice; he is obviously more technically proficient than I. However, I would respectfully remind everyone the most important part is to STAY WITH IT. Personally, I don't care if I row 6 or 600 watts, but I do care that I row that day for the time I set forth for myself. Long journeys are composed of single steps. Concentrating on getting on the machine when I am supposed to is my most important thing. In the beginning... new piece of equipment, lots of enthusiasiam... three months in... not so much. STAY WITH YOUR PROGRAM.
Now to be fair, I have no idea of what a watt is. But I believe, if you spent enough honest time on the machine, honest time mind you not phoning it in but not killing yourself, everything else will take care of itself. But the most important part is putting in the time over the long haul. Knocking yourself silly in the beginning is a great way to not have longevity. Sure you want to go out and whatever, but overtraining will lead to injury and misery. If your hurt you don't exercise; if you really dread getting on the machine, you will find an excuse not to. Please, just make a committment to getting on the machine and putting in an honest effort.
I do like the calorie counter though; but not for exercise purposes. I burn around 360 calories per 30 min. I compare the calories I burned and the effort it took to burn them to whatever I am about to stuff into my face. For me, diet is the hard part. So I try and relate what I really want to what really isn't worth it. For example, I would have to row 30 minutes to burn off three sodas, and I am not really into sodas. Simple. So putting the calories into perspective is helpful to me.

And I would suggest getting gloves. The erg really messed up my hands in the beginning and it turned into a thing. I did find these neoprene wraps that work well and no more issues. [ie eliminate obstacles]

P.S. If a watt looks like a supermodel and tastes like cake I am going to cry.

[Ergmeister]

Stay with it for sure. And be careful to not allow your intake to tick up as you are more ravenous from the work-outs. Be aware of form always. Bad form habits take only weeks to lock in and years to undo so try to consult a qualified coach to keep your form proper and in check whenever possible which will help to avoid both performance and injury problems.

On the raw hands topic, I discourage the use of gloves. Your hands will callus up and it's a rowing badge of honor. It doesn't take long for them to develop calluses and they will remind you to not mindlessly put food in your mouth.

Slow and steady will get you there.

[wphunter]

Had a good night on Friday! I went with a "workout of the day" 10,000 meter personal best attempt, and beat it by 1 minute 26 seconds. To top that off, the first 2,000 meters was also a personal best by 2 seconds and the first 5,000 meters another by 11 seconds. Need less to say I was stuffed on Saturday and Sunday, but very happy for it.
Wayne

[TheGreatFatsby]

I had forgotten that you use a WaterRower rather than a C2, but was reminded of it by Wayne's post. The principles should be pretty much the same, but I have no idea how the WR determines the work done. That said, if it does give watts, you can use that to calculate other ways of expressing the work done. Wayne provided a link to the C2 calorie calculator. That same page also lists (on the left side) some other calculator options, pace and watts, in particular. Watts is the best way of expressing the rate of putting work into the wheel - a least from the point of view of a physicist or engineer, but most forumites use pace, which is the time for 500m. Sometimes that is called split time, based on the concept of a 2k divided into 4 splits. I hope that this is helpful, but I still wonder about how much difference there is with the WR. Does that company have a website that gives any indication of what sort of performances can be expected on their machine? That might be helpful for making a comparison.

Bob S.

I'm going to see if there is a way the computer on my rower will show me all the info i've already been tracking plus watts, and if not, I'll consider tracking that instead of strokes per minute, as it seems to be more useful. Thanks again Bob for the help, I always appreciate your feedback.

I think Bob S. has some worthwhile advice; he is obviously more technically proficient than I. However, I would respectfully remind everyone the most important part is to STAY WITH IT. Personally, I don't care if I row 6 or 600 watts, but I do care that I row that day for the time I set forth for myself. Long journeys are composed of single steps. Concentrating on getting on the machine when I am supposed to is my most important thing. In the beginning... new piece of equipment, lots of enthusiasiam... three months in... not so much. STAY WITH YOUR PROGRAM.
Now to be fair, I have no idea of what a watt is. But I believe, if you spent enough honest time on the machine, honest time mind you not phoning it in but not killing yourself, everything else will take care of itself. But the most important part is putting in the time over the long haul. Knocking yourself silly in the beginning is a great way to not have longevity. Sure you want to go out and whatever, but overtraining will lead to injury and misery. If your hurt you don't exercise; if you really dread getting on the machine, you will find an excuse not to. Please, just make a committment to getting on the machine and putting in an honest effort.
I do like the calorie counter though; but not for exercise purposes. I burn around 360 calories per 30 min. I compare the calories I burned and the effort it took to burn them to whatever I am about to stuff into my face. For me, diet is the hard part. So I try and relate what I really want to what really isn't worth it. For example, I would have to row 30 minutes to burn off three sodas, and I am not really into sodas. Simple. So putting the calories into perspective is helpful to me.

And I would suggest getting gloves. The erg really messed up my hands in the beginning and it turned into a thing. I did find these neoprene wraps that work well and no more issues. [ie eliminate obstacles]

P.S. If a watt looks like a supermodel and tastes like cake I am going to cry.

Thank you, this is really what i'm trying to do overall. I do like tracking stats and numbers just to that I can see for myself that I am improving. Especially as I add more time on the rower, I like to see that I am not only going longer, but keeping the same pace I was with the shorter times. But I agree, it is a long haul for me and the most important thing is that I keep rowing.

Also, I believe the best looking watt is Naomi Watts.

Stay with it for sure. And be careful to not allow your intake to tick up as you are more ravenous from the work-outs. Be aware of form always. Bad form habits take only weeks to lock in and years to undo so try to consult a qualified coach to keep your form proper and in check whenever possible which will help to avoid both performance and injury problems.

On the raw hands topic, I discourage the use of gloves. Your hands will callus up and it's a rowing badge of honor. It doesn't take long for them to develop calluses and they will remind you to not mindlessly put food in your mouth.

Slow and steady will get you there.

Definitely staying with it and trying to keep good form in mind. It's difficult for me being so large to have anything resembling traditional good form. Until I can build an extension for the footboard my legs are still on the floor and my gut will be in the way of my stroke for my forseeable future, but I am doing as best as I can with form and trying to keep as close as I can to some example videos posted here.

Also, yes I'm already starting to get calluses and am currently debating whether or not to go with gloves. At first they were painful blisters, but now I've got small calluses under my middle and ring finger on both hands. I do understand how it's a badge of honor, I remember being proud when my fingertips callused when i first started playing guitar.

Had a good night on Friday! I went with a "workout of the day" 10,000 meter personal best attempt, and beat it by 1 minute 26 seconds. To top that off, the first 2,000 meters was also a personal best by 2 seconds and the first 5,000 meters another by 11 seconds. Need less to say I was stuffed on Saturday and Sunday, but very happy for it.
Wayne

Wow great job, Wayne! That's gotta feel great! Also, I just logged some meters and we are now 72 out of 147! Officially top 50% in this challenge! Great job!
______________________________

So here is what last week looked like for me, plus this morning:

Last week I did my first time trial in a while, and just like Wayne I was able to beat my personal best. My 1000m was a full 6.2 seconds better than my last! I was SO close to being under 2 min that I was sort of kicking myself at the end of the workout. But that night I was completely exhausted, and when I ranked myself I saw that the 3.5 seconds it would have taken me to be under 2 minutes would have moved my up 50+ places in the rankings.. so I wasn't so disappointed after seeing how much more grueling it would have been to come in under 2. But that is still my next short term goal.

Also, I just did my 12 min session and made it over 2600m! My best performance to date in distance and in my split time! Also, did my weekly weigh in and i've dropped another 5lb, for a total of 52lb lost since new years! Feels good, man!

Have a great week everyone!

[Bob S.]

Great report, TGF! It looks like it is working. Holding the pace under 2:20 for 12 minutes is a solid achievement. I am looking forward to your next report. Keep up the good work.

Bob .

[wphunter]

TGF, Naomi Watts, sounds good to me. Congrats on all your achievements in the last week. I am also keen on stats, any improvement is another carrot. And right now we are number 71!
Wayne