slides?

[PaulH]

You still didn't answer either question

[johnlvs2run]

Paul,

I answered your questions and explained them to you.

Time for your nap.

[johnlvs2run]

PaulH,

If this continues I'll have you sit on the naughty chair.

[PaulH]

So you concede either that performace declines with altitude, or that lightweights are slower on slides than on a static erg. Well I was hoping for something more specific, but I guess that will have to do. Thanks.

[johnlvs2run]

Now Paul I'm putting you on the naughty chair for being a bad boy and you'll need to sit there for 56 minutes.

[PaulH]

I'm not quite sure how talk of a naughty chair furthers the discussion, John. I understand your desire to take a parent role in our interaction, and regret that your attempt is so clumsy. But if you find solace in it then perhaps it serves a purpose.

Cheers, Paul

[nkoffler]

How many of you use slides?

What do slides add to your workout that you dont get without them?

Since very few posts actually answered these questions, I'll give it a go.

I have exclusively used slides for nearly two years after have exclusively used a static erg for two years prior. Obviously, I like them. A lot of this has to do with feel. I see the following as benefits:

1) Easier to watch TV since you don't move around as much
2) Easier to vary stroke rate and focus on power per stroke
3) Easier to hone proper technique
4) Less stressful on the catch than a static erg
5) I'm told it's more of a boatlike feel. It definitely feels different from a static erg.
6) Compatibility with Xeno's DVD workouts.
7) Ability to do legs only or one-legged exercises.

Drawbacks:
1) You don't move around as much which means you definitely need a C-Breeze. (Not really a drawback since you should have one anyway).
2) They cost $200+.
3) They take up a lot of room and make set-up more cumbersome. (I have the erg set up permanently.)
4) They aren't used in competition so you need to get off them to prep.

You can rank your slide pieces and your slide meters. There is a input which allows you to note the times are on slides. The summary rankings don't indicate this (to John Rupp's consternation).

As for whether the slides are faster than a static erg, I haven't had that experience. More importantly, it doesn't really matter. If you use slides you can try to improve against yourself on slides. Other peoples times are only a point of reference and motivation. For competition and records, slides aren't used.

Hope that helps,

Neil

[ancho]

...
You know that precise has nothing to do with correctness. For example, to say that you weigh 98.38593288594kg would be both extremely precise and very wrong.

That's like my sales forecasting: Very precise, but highly inaccurate!

[johnlvs2run]

For competition and records, slides aren't used.

Except in the rankings.

[Andy99]

nkoffler

Thanks for an answer I could understand. Everyone else Thank you but you lost me on page 2.

[Andy99]

I use slides for variety, and to have more of a sense of OTW rowing, which they do give you, since the boat moves under you, as does the erg with the slides. And, they do tend to require you to use good form, right from the first pull, as otherwise, you'll bang to the stops. Just like in the boat.

I also think they're easier on the lower back if you have imperfect form, which we all do ... even if only from time-to-time or pull-to-pull.


All just my OPINION however.

I have a follow up question after reading this post. I am new to this sport. Im going to purchase a concept 2 but I was wondering if i should get the slides. Space is not an issue I have a place I can leave everything set up. I was wondering since im still learning the proper form and technique if the slides would force me to really have good form or would it make it more difficult for me to learn. Also I am worried about hurting my back if I make a mistake in my form. If the slides are indeed easier on the back is it worth the extra money for that reason alone???

[johnlvs2run]

Andy,

You can have the right form either way and I wouldn't say the slides make it any different or easier to learn, but you can feel the push with your legs a lot more so that's good.

If you are interested in the slides then I would recommend that you get them.

You will very likely enjoy having them.

[mpukita]

I have a follow up question after reading this post. I am new to this sport. Im going to purchase a concept 2 but I was wondering if i should get the slides. Space is not an issue I have a place I can leave everything set up. I was wondering since im still learning the proper form and technique if the slides would force me to really have good form or would it make it more difficult for me to learn. Also I am worried about hurting my back if I make a mistake in my form. If the slides are indeed easier on the back is it worth the extra money for that reason alone???

My opinion is that: 1) YES, they will make you use better form, but not so much that it will be a problem or a challenge for you. My bet is that they will make you a more natural rower right from the start; 2) I also feel that they will be easier on your back.

-- Mark

[jamesg]

If you're interested in sculling, then I think it's best to use slides. The catch characteristic on a fixed erg is so different (sloppy) to that in a boat (instantaneous), that I find I have to use two different techniques. For fitness only it doesn't matter.

As to whether slides are faster, the question is put wrongly. The question should be, can I go faster on the slides? There are two possible answers: yes if they remove a limitation to putting work into the handle, and yes if they let me save "non-productive" power (in shuttling up and down for example) and put this work saved into the handle.

I've seen the first, and it's very easy: just do a set of flat out 100m pulls, on and off the slides. It was immediately obvious that some limitations disappear on slides, and I could work a lot harder. The second I've not seen because I've not tried; and it's clear that to see it, we would have to learn how. Any tests done in the past show only the results that the tests could show (not necessarily what the testers thought) and if the people tested had learnt how to use the two different types of machine.

There are other ways of reducing power limitations too: pull in cold dry air rather than hot and humid, to maximise cooling; use a fan or similar, to get the same effect; lose weight or row naked (also for cooling) to reduce inertial forces and the power needed to produce them. All cheating of course...

[billw]

Hello,

I have got slides. I only row on the erg.

Why ?

1. Saw some references to slides being easier on your back under certain conditions - ie poor technique

2. I like gadgets


I posted something in the old forum after I first got them - cannot remember exactly what I said back then - my current perception is that they make make me faster because I can achieve a higher rating far more easily and I think that gives me a faster sprint to the line on a PB or race.

I have done 40spm on slides and cannot achieve that on stationary.

Feels very strange at first but when you get used to it is comfortable.

Feels really wierd going back to a grounded erg - feels like my legs are 6" longer than they really are and there are a pair of phantom feet 6" the other side of the footplates - quite an odd sensation and thats the best way I can describe it. Ankles feel a bit queer as well.

I think the one interesting way for an amateur to test would be to do 10 pieces slides alternating with 10 pieces grounded over 20 days ie 8k s10ps 2k+20 - alternate the days and then check percieved exertion and heart rates at the end - if there is any advantage in slides then with enough data it should show up as lower heart rates for same pace distance and spi for the same person - comparing data over many days should sort out any statistical noise in the HR - maybe 10 days isnt enough.

Anyway bottom line - I like slides and I think they make me sprint to the line faster.



Bill hwt