1/2 and 3/4 stroke racing start on erg?

[jackarabit]

Would the OTW racing start be an advantage or disadvantage in erging the shorter TT events? Is it used at the erg racing venues? Easier on the back than the Xfitter's' initial chain breaker pull? Possible faster acceleration to pace? Found nothing searching this site. I tried a few such starts tonite using two successive leg extension pulls no back no arms followed by my best approximation of a 3/4 stoke involving back but no arms and then five or six full pulls. Did a couple of starts with initial full stroke and five or more of my best for comparison. My impression that going sub 2' pace was easier and faster with the short strokes but no objective measure attempted. I won't be setting the world on fire with my 1:59.1 for 500K but I wouldn't mind if I could get it down a bit or simply have easier starts. It seems to me that I'd use it for the 2K and maybe everything if it got me on pace only just as fast as the gorilla pull. Thoughts?

Jack

[hjs]

Most people do, use whatever start you find the fastest.

[jackarabit]

Thanks for reply. I'll look to see if there is video of this approach to starting. Missed it thus far; only just learned about this technique from a tip by a collegiate rower in a crossfit forum. Odd that. Most of those wide boys don't finesse much from the few utube vids I've watched.

Jack

[Edward4492]

I think most competitive ergers use some version of several short quick strokes to get the wheel spinning, then up to a maximum of ten hard pulls; then settle in. I always go with approximately a 3/4, 1/2, 3/4, then 6 or 7 over-reaching long strokes which will take me down into the 1:30's. Then I try and hold about a second below my goal pace for 30s, sit on my goal pace for the next 30s, hang on for dear life for 15s and sprint the last 15s. The 500m is a bit of an outlier event (as Jim Gratten aka "cycling man" has posted about at length) as it really does not fit the pattern needed for a solid 2000m or longer. You have to do an almost "fly and die" because there's no time to calculate negative splits or make up lost time at the start. You blast the start, keep it going through the middle with just a hair of backing off, then hang on to the sprint and gun it to the end. Watch any videos of Rob Smith. And keep in mind, doing a PR 2000m is a totally different animal. And you're right about the crossfitter's, many of them do an eyeball- crossing first coupla pulls, not sure it's the best way.

57 yr. Lwt
1:33.4 500m, 3:21.6 1000m, 7:01.8 2000m, 18:54.8 5000m

[lindsayh]

I used to do the short stroke starts especially in the 500 but last few years have gone to full stroke from the start. I really don't think it makes a lot of difference either way but maybe there is an argument to get fast as quickly as you can and that short strokes wont do that.
I think there are some threads on the UK site about it and that the consensus there was full stroke from the start. I think that the really fast 500 guys like Dirk Muller go full stoke from the first - there are plenty of recordings on You Tube.

[jackarabit]

Looking back, I see I wrote 500 kilometres rather than meters COL! At 66 yrs. old and post cardiac rehab, my ambitions for pull and puke are modest. I'm doing the Pete beginner plan trying to rate in the mid-high 20s and row my weight for average wattage. This gets more attainable as my weight drops. For me, the 2K does present a more controlled context for measuring progress and regress. Thanx for replies.

Jack

[jackarabit]

The IRC vids from Boston show some competitors in a partial stroke start. Can't see more than three or four rowers beginning each heat. My impression full stroke starts in majority.

Jack

[Izzzmeister]

I do, but I learned to row from a rowing coach. Half, half, 3/4, 3/4, then 10 to 15 pulls looking for 1:33 on speed & below 1:40 on average. Then, I ease in.
If you watch the ergers, like at the CRASH-Bs, you see a lot of bad form, like pulling the handle up to their chin. In the water, that'd be a disaster, but on the erg, it could add a foot to your stroke (or injure your shoulders or back). Some even do it in 2 parts - a pull to their bellies, then an upward tug to their chins!
To me, the closer to true rowing I am, the better.

[ArmandoChavezUNC]

I think a start sequence such as 1/2, 3/4, lengthen, full is beneficial on the erg, as you're starting from a dead stop. I wouldn't pull too many short strokes though, you definitely want to lengthen out as soon as you get the flywheeel spinning and the split down.

[Cyclingman1]

I used to do the short stroke starts especially in the 500 but last few years have gone to full stroke from the start.

My personal experience is that 10 to 12 short strokes is more effective and less draining than 10 or so extra hard long strokes at the start. There is too much dead time in long strokes and they take a lot of you. Of course, the main consideration is to not put one's self in energy deficit. The ATP system is good for about ten seconds. And then the anaerobic lactic acid system takes over and that is only good for 40 secs or so, not to mention the lactic acid accumulation at the end of that time. One has to find the sustainable aerobic level very quickly. The lower average pace that the quick strokes establish helps one to not overpull for the first minute or so trying to get the pace down.

[lindsayh]

My personal experience is that 10 to 12 short strokes is more effective and less draining than 10 or so extra hard long strokes at the start

I agree Jim that if you make those first ten strokes "extra hard" in an effort to get down there too quickly you can give the muscles the wrong message about energy pathways. IMO have to be careful not to overcook the start chasing a low average too early and short or full strokes is really a matter of what suits individuals probably related to muscle type/strength etc.

[jackarabit]

Most likely won't benefit those with any power whatsoever but have to say I found a start gimmick that I like: one quick bicep jerk from the catch position no legs followed immediately by a smooth full stroke but not attempting to wind the wheel to more revs than my back and shoulders can hold up to. Subjectively seems a bit faster in my case than going up the slide for a partial stroke and easier on my aging carcass than a chain breaker pull. My wife is using a half stroke initial slide. It looks quick and energetic enuf to almost make me think she has the method that suits her also.

Jack