Challenge to John Foy!!

[Nosmo]

Has ANYONE commented about this fellows style or technique, anyone at all?

I mentioned several times that he is likely to go faster if he had some coaching and encouraged him several times to post a video. I also mentioned in regards to his sore back.

As for why John would utter such a ridiculous thing in the first place, I can come up with any number of theories, but wouldn't be so presumptuous to think any of them were correct. However it seems entirely in character.

[PaulS]

Has ANYONE commented about this fellows style or technique, anyone at all?

I mentioned several times that he is likely to go faster if he had some coaching and encouraged him several times to post a video. I also mentioned in regards to his sore back.

As for why John would utter such a ridiculous thing in the first place, I can come up with any number of theories, but wouldn't be so presumptuous to think any of them were correct. However it seems entirely in character.

I see. Thanks for clearing that up. Have you got on John's bad side by noting his gift for being 180deg out of reality? Perhaps he was making a snipe because he has nothing useful to offer.

A video would be great to assist the new man, and I'm sure he will get quality advice if it is posted. Perhaps John should be encuraged to post a video of his own to show how his self taught technique/style has evolved over the many years of rebelling against the "know it alls".

[Nosmo]

Has ANYONE commented about this fellows style or technique, anyone at all?

I mentioned several times that he is likely to go faster if he had some coaching and encouraged him several times to post a video. I also mentioned it in regards to his sore back.

As for why John would utter such a ridiculous thing in the first place, I can come up with any number of theories, but wouldn't be so presumptuous to think any of them were correct. However it seems entirely in character.

I see. Thanks for clearing that up. Have you got on John's bad side by noting his gift for being 180deg out of reality? Perhaps he was making a snipe because he has nothing useful to offer.

A video would be great to assist the new man, and I'm sure he will get quality advice if it is posted. Perhaps John should be encuraged to post a video of his own to show how his self taught technique/style has evolved over the many years of rebelling against the "know it alls".

Am I on John's bad side? We have had a couple of arguments but I am unaware of being on his bad side. I have noticed once he gets an idea into his head he is not going to change it despite logic and reason, or perhaps he is just unwilling to lose an argument.

What I would really like to see is a video of John in a racing single. Now that would be fun.

[eoinom]

Hey guys hows things sorry havent posted in a while was away on a mountain biking weekend in the wicklow mountains and i was cursing that damn rower all weekend my lower back was in a state going into the off-roading

Well not looking good on beating John's P.B had two more go's on the rower since and both times i have gotten worse 38.50 and 38.30 or something like that both in the 38's inanyway not beaten my P.B .

Lads to be honest with you's i'm finding it a bit offputting on this forum i feel a bit like i've to prove myselfs with screen shots and pictures of me and how i did a 28 min and it doesn't compare- for starters in my very first post i said how i found the 28 mins easy enough and i only had to get under 40mins to get a free 6 months membership so i never pushed myself- then when i reset the machine i gave it socks and went for it to try beat johns time.

Had a great weekend mountain biking with the lads doing all sort of off roading trails and then camping at night- heard stories off the lads all weekend of how other lads did the trans alps and times when they cycled for 22 hours straight and you know not once did any of us turn around and say do you have a picture of that or thats impossible we just take people on there word over here. Some times theres no logic in some things the human body can push itself to extremes , the night before the dublin marathon myself and a friend met a lad from south africa in temple bar , we had just met him in our marathon tee-shirts and got chatting we stayed there me and my mate drinking coke and water because we were running the next morning , the south african guy had about 8-10 pints of guiness we met him the following morning before and after the race and he finished the marathon in 2:40 me and my mate over 3 :50 -- we had all the proper preparation and he destroyed us .
It reminds me of and einsten quote .

Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts.


To john you have a fantastic pb and i will continue to try beat it this month but i doubt it now. good luck with your training.

[johnlvs2run]

heard stories off the lads all weekend of how other lads did the trans alps and times when they cycled for 22 hours straight and you know not once did any of us turn around and say do you have a picture of that or thats impossible we just take people on there word over here.

Inspiring stuff.

Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts.

That's interesting as I was given that quote in a speaking club 10 days ago, and replied with a story of a jumping spider that was eating and leaving piles of ants on my window sill.

[Nosmo]

Eoinom,
You have more then proved yourself. I certainly am very impressed with what you did as are a lot of others. John has already conceded the challenge. I have been asking for the video so we can help you row faster. I am going to do my best to beat your 38:05 this month but really I would be happier to see you knock another 20 seconds off your time and have to send you a T shirt. However I am going to use this as motivation to see if I can take 45 seconds off last years best. I did just take 25 seconds off last years 5k so it may be possible. But Johns PR is definitely out of reach for me.
I think what you've done is damn impressive.
In the past there have been a few people on the forum who have made wild claims about what they could do. There have been long threads on whether someone did or did not do what they claimed. The skepticism results for a long history on this forum of dubious claims. Not every one here is skeptical.
Again your sore back is probably due to improper technique. Next time you go to the gym. Go for an easy long row. Something like an hour at a 2:05 pace. Set the display to view the force curve. Try to make it smooth. If you are getting double humps then you have technique problems. Make sure you are not lifting your arms over your knees on the drive or the recovery. Take breaks if you are loosing your concentration or your back hurts.

At the end of the drive put your arms out and rotate the top of the pelvis forward so you are sitting more towards the front of your sit bones. This will cause you to sit taller without hyper-extending your back, and will engage your stomach muscles a bit more. You want to feel long both in the front and back of your torso. Rotating the top of the pelvis forward initiates the forward body lean and inhibits your knees from lifting. Get your body angle set before coming forward on the slide. Hold the body angle constant as you start the drive. If you body angle is set and your pelvis forward there will be much less stress on your back.

How was your pacing on the 38:50 and 38:30?

I'm a bit jealous of your mountain biking weekend. I checked out the Wicklow Mountains on the web. I'll have to go there some day. I'm originally a bike rider and have been mixing rowing and cycling for many years. This last year I've really only been rowing. I acutally bought a new bicycle last fall and didn't put it together until about a month ago and haven't even taken it for a real ride yet!

[eoinom]

Hey Nosmo , i know you were giving advice I wasn't getting on your case man sorry- I just wanted to put a point across. My pacing wasn't great i think my biggest problem is time constraints in the gym I usually only go to swim and I may be trying to rush it in to get to the pool, plus i've been so tired after the last go i just went straight home missed my swim.

Now that John has stopped training I may concede and ease up and may only try a shorter distance on the rower. I was chatting to a work mate of mine and he's a kayaker and i'm going kayaking with him in a couple of weeks so the practice i have should come in useful.

The Wicklow mountains are awesome really good for mountain biking there is some beautiful trails and views ,the weather was perfect it is about 6 or 7 degrees and a lovely cool fresh breeze allows you to cool down quickly, if your ever over give us a shout we will sort out a spare bike for you and that no problem.

[Stefan]

Lads to be honest with you's i'm finding it a bit offputting on this forum i feel a bit like i've to prove myselfs with screen shots and pictures of me

I am sorry you feel that way, there has been others making crazy claims (like the apearance of yours). You are obviously honest and just do not bother about requests for verifications, etc. That is only needed for close to WR results!

In my experience, this (and the UK version) is a very friendly, self regulating and honest forum. I have never had my results questioned and I think it is very rare. We would only be kidding ourselves anyway and it would be impossible for a regular contributor to remember and make sense of false claims.

Your back would hurt even if your form was fine. It is a crazy effort to go 10k in 38 minutes as a first go on the erg and of course you shocked some muscles.

It is a good proposal to post some video capture from the side when you row at normal speed. Others have done it and got good coaching advice by very quallified individuals.

I recomend you to build a bit slower. Do not try very hard every time you are on the rower. I like the PetePlan to give good variation in the training. Have a look at this thread (I am Gothenburg in the UK forum) http://www.concept2.co.uk/forum/viewtop ... f=4&t=5409

[PaulS]

No reason to be "put off", but perhaps you now understand why a 28 minute 10k drew a bit of skepticism, and though you honestly saw with your own eyes what you had done, and responded appropriately, sometimes things get carried away, like someone bothering you with the "screenshot" crap for a 38 minute 10k.

If you don't understand the implications of a 28 minute 10k, then just try to row at a 1:24 pace for as long as you can, and if you make it to 2000m you will have accomplished a WR performance.

Stick around for a while and you will find the group supportive, but do realize that many have been here for years, and see things like, "I rowed yesterday at a 3:00 pace and today at 2:30, that means in the next couple days I should be at 1:30. What's so tough about that?"

Great beginning 10k BTW! Can't help but think you've got some good fitness to begin with.

[Nosmo]

Eoinom,
Did a 10K erg this morning 37:56.9. 1:53.85 ave.
So that is your T-Shirt time to beat. Thanks for the motivation to try it. I would have done intervals if it wasn't for your challenge.

Almost no chance I would do another one this month. Going to Mexico next Wed, and will probably only be rowing on the water until then.

52 seconds faster than last year.
1K Splits & rating:
1000 1:54.9 25
2000 1:54.5 26
3000 1:54.1 26
4000 1:54.0 26
5000 1:53.8 25
6000 1:53.8 25
7000 1:53.5 26
8000 1:53.7 26
9000 1:54.4 26
10000 1:51.7 27

Nosmo, 150 lbs, 47 years 5'7"

[Stefan]

And I did mine yesterday evening.

Ended up 38.03,1
Last 2 k split was 10 s slower than the average...
I noticed my SB at 30 min and did a momentary handle down before deciding to continue but did not get into it well again.