shoulder muscle build-up

[elfm]

I've been rowing for a little more than a year. I really like the calorie burning/stress reliever aspects of it, but I've built my shoulder and back muscles up more than I want to. I didn't think that that would happen because I don't row particularly fast and I set the damper at 3, but it has. I don't want to give up rowing, but I also don't want to buy all new suit jackets. Any help would be appreciated.

[Ducatista]

I can't imagine ever thinking "Uh oh, too much shoulder and back muscle." I keep hoping rowing will turn me into Serena Williams. So far, no such luck.

Sorry, that's not helpful, is it? Here's a question: do you know you've built mass because you can see more muscle, or because your clothes fit differently? If you're just seeing more muscle, it may be that you have more definition thanks to less body fat, but you haven't really added much bulk. But if you're straining your suit-jacket shoulders, then I guess you are in a pickle. Good luck!

[PaulH]

If you've built those muscles up to such an extent it suggests to me that either:

1) You must have thighs like tree trunks by now, or
2) You're doing it wrong.

Given that you didn't mention your thighs, I'm going to go with 2. So, how's your technique?

[grams]

I believe you might have to get some new clothes. When I was erging regularly and had lost 25 pounds my shoulder and back muscles were better defined, and so were my chest muscles. Although I had lost 3 clothing sizes and my bra cup size went from a c to a b, I still looked better.

Maybe some of it was posture-keeping my shoulders back instead of all hunched over. Anyhow, I got compliments from total strangers on how I looked, and everyone thought I was 10 years younger.

For me those results were more important than my wardrobe so I bought some new clothes. I did keep some of the old ones just in case. I have put on 20 pounds since my knee op so I am back into the old clothes, back on the erg, and working towards those muscle shirts for this summer.

Years ago when I was playing 'over 35' women's soccer the same thing happened. I had to buy new jeans and new shirts. Alas, I'm too old to play soccer (arthritis and a bad back) so the erg will have to do the same job for me.

grams

[elfm]

I think my technique's okay. I had it checked out by someone who knows what he's doing. Here's the thing. I'm not talking about incredible hulk type build-up. But whereas almost all guys want an athletic look, some women want an athletic look whereas others want what I think of as a dancer's/pilates look with toned, but not particularly muscularly defined arms. Now, obviously, if you want a dancer's look, you should take dance classes, which I do, but I also enjoy rowing very much, particulary for stress relief and calorie burning. But I don't really want that athletic muscle definition--just a personal choice.(I realize that women don't build up muscle the way men do.) So to cut down the work the upper body is doing, should I lower the damper setting, or just row longer and more slowly or what?

[PaulH]

Hmm... it certainly wouldn't hurt to row at damper 2 or even 1. My guess is you still need to concentrate on technique. If I'm rowing normally my technique can look ok (not good, but ok). If I concentrate it can actually *be* ok as well

So concentrate on really pushing with the legs - the rest of the stroke is essentially 'finishing off', especially the arms. If you can get enough power into the fan with your legs, your back and arms would largely be just keeping up rather than applying much additional power. I find this hard; I can do it for a few dozen strokes and then my legs get tired and I start to cheat again, but if you can modulate the effort right it should help.

Also think about relaxing your shoulders (think of showing off your neck), and trying to get that finish pulling with your lats rather than your shoulders. This is something I've really struggled with, but if you get it right your shoulders aren't really contributing much more than stabilization, which should help your problem.

Finally, you can hope that someone who knows more about technique than me wanders by

[Mr. Wu]

If I'm rowing normally my technique can look ok (not good, but ok). If I concentrate it can actually *be* ok as well

So concentrate on really pushing with the legs - the rest of the stroke is essentially 'finishing off', especially the arms. If you can get enough power into the fan with your legs, your back and arms would largely be just keeping up rather than applying much additional power. I find this hard; I can do it for a few dozen strokes and then my legs get tired and I start to cheat again, but if you can modulate the effort right it should help.

I can certainly relate to your experience. When my back and arms are tired, I sometimes concentrate on my technique and drive more with my legs. When I do that, my back and arms just, like you said, finish off the strokes, so I can get some relief in those muscles. But then my legs get tired after a minute or two, and I go back to the old, less powerful strokes. I agree, to use the right technique is harder than to appear to use it. Or maybe we are just weak. What do you think, Paul?

[PaulH]

Well I'm sure I'm weak The thing I find hard is making a moderate effort - I can scull along fairly relaxed (not slacking, but comfortable), and I can go full-on (for a short time!), but I find it hard to do anything in between. So trying to depend on my legs *and* row at 80% is hard!

[elfm]

By George, I think he's got it! Paul, you were right about technique being a problem. I really paid attention to my stroke today, and I haven't been making my legs do their fair share of the work--plus lowering the damper number helped, too. Thanks for the advice.

[PaulH]

You're very welcome - please come back and let us know how you get on!

[larkl]

So concentrate on really pushing with the legs - the rest of the stroke is essentially 'finishing off', especially the arms. If you can get enough power into the fan with your legs, your back and arms would largely be just keeping up rather than applying much additional power. I find this hard; I can do it for a few dozen strokes and then my legs get tired and I start to cheat again

The "Flip Luisi" video on technique online (easy to find with google) emphasizes that your arm/shoulder muscles should not engage until after your legs have pretty much finished the power drive. Says your arms should feel pulled out of their sockets at the beginning of the leg drive.

I think I start to lean back earlier than the video suggests, but I do wait to start my arm draw until my arms feel pulled and stretched by my leg drive. This ensures that I engage my arms significantly after my legs have started pushing. I have to keep reminding myself of this, I tend to forget if I'm trying to go fast.

However when I'm trying to row at a fixed pace and I want to throw in some speed to get the pace on the monitor down, doing a few good strong arm pulls really helps.

But I don't mind building up my shoulders, I want the upper body strength. I do assisted chinups and pullups as well as rowing.

Laura

[Mr. Wu]

So trying to depend on my legs *and* row at 80% is hard!

I agree. But luckily, I'm mostly going to do 50-60% long rows in the near future, just to put more meters in so Mrs. Wu doesn't beat me to 1 million meters by too much.

elfm, hope you'll figure out how to get the figure you want.

[Hapa]

Hi elfm,

Unfortunately, for females, even if you're not rowing very hard, or for very long periods of time, you will build up more shoulder and arm muscle. Because us women typically don't have any sort of upper body strength, whenever you start working those muscles, you will see some growth there, resulting in suit jackets being tighter in the arms and across the mid-back where your lat muscles are (that v shape your back might be getting).

I remember when I started rowing back in college, when I had little twig arms since my only sports activity was track and cross-country, all of us novices had our own moments of epiphany when brushing our teeth or hair and seeing bicep muscles in the mirror!!

Probably not what you want to hear, but I'll bet that even if you only focused on the dancer / pilates physique, you would still see some problems in the fit of suits due to the tailored nature of the clothing and natural changes in your musculature. Even with the slightly leaner nature of dancers and pilates folks, if you're adding muscle (even slight muscle) to where there was none before, you're going to have a problem. Or, if you're changing from fat to muscle, you're probably still going to have to do some altering and new wardrobe purchasing.

Good luck!!

Aiko

[grams]

When Time magazine asked Raquel Welsh what part of her body she was most proud of she said "My back"

grams

[larkl]

Unfortunately, for females, even if you're not rowing very hard, or for very long periods of time, you will build up more shoulder and arm muscle.

When I was in my 20's I lifted weights for a while. I'd burst the seams in my shirts when I flexed my muscles. I loved it :D Laura