Concept2 Forum

almost all winter I've treated myself to protein smoothies made with various fruits, choc. milk, and ice cream with 22g protein and teaspoon of glutamin.

right now I want to change the recipe for experimental purposes(maybe 3 weeks or so). I want to eliminate dairy from my diet for 3 weeks and see what happens... if anything. however by eliminating dairy i am butchering my perfected formula.

i heard from a friend that water, banana and orange juice is good.

any suggestions?

I have a post workout shake of whey protein in 8 oz of water, followed by 8 oz of grape juice. This is a good combination for post workout drinks as it's the right amounts of protein and quick release carbs to feed my depleted muscles. You don't want your rowing workouts to canabolize your muscles, just fat.

csabour wrote:almost all winter I've treated myself to protein smoothies made with various fruits, choc. milk, and ice cream with 22g protein and teaspoon of glutamin.

right now I want to change the recipe for experimental purposes(maybe 3 weeks or so). I want to eliminate dairy from my diet for 3 weeks and see what happens... if anything. however by eliminating dairy i am butchering my perfected formula.

i heard from a friend that water, banana and orange juice is good.

any suggestions?

Cutting out dairy is a good idea (e.g., see The China Study). I have never needed dairy in my smoothies, and about two months ago I stopped using my protein supplement in my smoothies because they were dairy based: e.g., whey or casein. I especially liked the casein based protein supplement.

Anyway, for a plant-based complete protein, you can add three tablespoons of nutritional yeast and get 24 grams of protein, plus all kinds of vitamins, minerals, and other phytonutrients.

Here's one of my basic smoothies: three cups thawed blueberries, one banana, one apple, 4 tablespoons of nutritional yeast or brewer's yeast. If you want it sweeter add some Stevia. This gives you plenty of carbohydrates from whole fruit and the protein boost you want without dairy. Optional, to have it cold add at the end one cup of frozen spinach instead of ice. You won't know the spinach is in it, and it gives you some more nutrients.

Just an idea to think about (there are also rice proteins and pea protein and soy protein supplements out there that you could use instead of nutritional yeast).

What type of protein supplement have you been using?

Mike

Mike,

Your smoothies sound alright. however its going to be a shock from chocolate icecream shakes .

I've been using some standard low carb why powder which my brother stopped using.

The tub is almost empty, so when i need to refill i will do a little research and get somthing that makes better sense for me.

I didn't realized that whey had dairy in it... I have plenty of fruit laying around, including some frozen berries from the stores.

Cam.

csabour wrote:Mike,

Your smoothies sound alright. however its going to be a shock from chocolate icecream shakes .

I've been using some standard low carb why powder which my brother stopped using.

The tub is almost empty, so when i need to refill i will do a little research and get somthing that makes better sense for me.

I didn't realized that whey had dairy in it... I have plenty of fruit laying around, including some frozen berries from the stores.

Cam.

My first experience with whey was on my Uncle's farm in the Summers. We used to go over to the local dairy and fill 50 gal drums full of whey to feed to our pigs. Back then (1960s), the dairies gave away the whey free to anyone who would come and pick it up. We'd make daily runs. The pigs thrived on it, but it was pretty sticky stuff. Whey is a by-product of making cheese.

Who would have thought that someday I would be drinking that stuff? At least it is flavored.

Mike

Hey guys,

Not sure what to think of all this whey protien stuff. I have been to some doping clinics before going away to big regattas and I was always told that whey protien can possibly make you test positive on your doping test. Anyone else hear anything like that before?

I didn't realized that whey had dairy in it

Whey is a milk product. Remember Little Miss Muffet? Eating her curds and whey? That would be cottage cheese where the lumps are the curds and the liquid is the whey.

i know were whey protien comes from. But what you buy at a store is not the straight left overs from making cheese. Last time I checked strawberry, vanilla and chocolate flavored cheese were not among the selection at my local grociery store. not to mention they have to alter it in some way so that it is actually soluable in milk, juice, or whatever else you mix it with. plus i think you can even get whey protien with extra amino acids. Also, I believe I have heard that some whey protien formulas contain aspertame......=CANCER!!!!!


WHATS WRONG WITH LEAN MEAT PRODUCTS

Engine#4 wrote:i know were whey protien comes from. But what you buy at a store is not the straight left overs from making cheese. Last time I checked strawberry, vanilla and chocolate flavored cheese were not among the selection at my local grociery store. not to mention they have to alter it in some way so that it is actually soluable in milk, juice, or whatever else you mix it with. plus i think you can even get whey protien with extra amino acids. Also, I believe I have heard that some whey protien formulas contain aspertame......=CANCER!!!!!


WHATS WRONG WITH LEAN MEAT PRODUCTS

Whey protein comes in all kinds of different formulations based on the manufacturer and marketing needs. We can drink whey straight, but most manufacturers tweak it. It is an excellent protein; perhaps the best in that it is quickly absorbed. So as a general rule we only drink whey protein immediately after a work out, and then during the day use a protein that is absorbed more slowly; for example, a casein based protein.

But protein is not all that important. An active athlete according to many studies needs no more than .8 grams per kilogram of weight, although most companies hype a higher level, but we just eliminate or store as fat the calories from too much protein and it wreaks havoc on our kidneys if we eat too much (which I have done in the past).

When you start drinking lots of whey protein, you will bulk up fast: i.e., gain weight and by pumping iron also increase muscle. I have been weight training for almost 40 years, and over those years all kinds of different theories have risen, and I have tried them all. Of course, years ago we did not have anywhere near all the products we have now and whey protein was not generally accepted or even known about it: egg protein was the standard. Just so you know, I have had success with just 45 grams of protein a day from milk, eggs, meat, protein powders of all kinds, and I have also eaten as much as 150 to 200 grams of protein a day and had success doing that.

Presently, I am using plant-based proteins and guess what? I'm having success with that too (plus my blood pressure has fallen, my cholesterol has fallen, and based on various medical studies I am reducing the risk of colon, prostrate, and other cancers, as well as reducing the risk of heart attack, etc.). I eat enough diverse unrefined whole foods that I get plenty of protein from grains, legumes, nuts, seeds, fruits, and vegetables.

Basically, if you eat nutrient rich foods, you will get all the protein you need. What you need however is glycogen stores if you are an athlete, and this is where complex carbohydrates come in as well as the essential fatty acids.

A balanced diet is the key. H=ND/TC + E (health equals nutrient dense calories over total calories plus exercise) There are no shortcuts to healthful living, but we don't need to be fanatics either. A good piece of meat now and then is quite nice indeed. But we do need to be careful about eating meat and eating too much. We all know this.

You may want to read The China Study to get an idea of what a lot of research indicates is wrong with lean meat products from an overall health perspective and why you may want to eat meat sparingly if at all (i.e., keep animal protein below 10% of your daily calorie intake). Whey is an animal protein as is casein -- that got my attention and is why I am now experimenting with plant-based proteins which are complete proteins. And why nutritional yeast is a complete protein supplement you can consider as well as other plant based protein supplements. Apparently, the adverse effects of too much animal protein do not occur with too much plant-based protein.

If you are young, then you can probably eat anything you want, but when you cross the 60 year old mark you may want to be more prudent with your eating and start working on losing the excess weight, avoiding high blood pressure medicines, cholesterol lowering medicines, etc. Fortunately, in my opinion because I have exercised frequently and eaten relatively healthy during my 60 years I am in great health and on no medications, but the goal is always to do better and what is necessary. Beginning at a younger age is better than beginning at an older age.

Now I get what you are saying about lean meat but what I really want to know is if there is a possibility that I could test postitive using whey protien or other protien supplements?

Engine#4 wrote:Now I get what you are saying about lean meat but what I really want to know is if there is a possibility that I could test postitive using whey protien or other protien supplements?

A lot of athletes take supplements and this is an area of concern vis-a-vis doping tests. It is impossible to guarantee the status of supplement products – that is to say, no governing body can give an athlete the all clear to take any supplement product – even something like vitamins or protein powders. This is because supplement products do not go through the same manufacturing process as pharmaceutical products – so once supplement products are manufactured, there is no checking done on them to determine that what is listed on the label is exactly what’s in the product. There have been many instances where supplements have been found to be contaminated with other products and even instances where these contaminants have been found to be prohibited substances. This is the issue: contamination.

In fact a study in the USA in 2001 found that 15% of the 600 products they tested contained a prohibited substance. Certainly more recently in the USA the USADA lab tested 5 products on the market and all 5 of them contained an anabolic steroid!

Athletes need to be aware that a positive test is a strict liability offence, so even if a prohibited substance was to get into their bodies through a contaminated supplement, they would still have an Anti-doping Rule Violation processed against them.

While a substance like whey protein or vitamin B is permitted in its pure form, there is never any way to ensure that it is in its pure form.

Therefore, you have to be careful if you buy a protein supplement with added herbs, or other chemical ingredients such as androstene-dione, human growth complex, tribulus terrestris, herbs such as ma huang (Chinese ephedra) and the newest rage, ribose, among many others.

Some athletes have claimed after failing a doping test that they used certain over the counter products. While these products were not whey, I have seen whey protein supplements containing ingredients that could cause a positive test and disqualify you. You need to read the labels but that is still no guarantee that a whey protein supplement (or any protein supplement) is not contaminated.

Again, a substance like whey protein in its pure form or vitamin B (or other vitamins) is permitted in its pure form, BUT there is never any way to ensure that any protein supplement is in its pure form. We really do not know the manufacturer's quality controls to avoid contamination, etc.

Be careful. (Although some manufacturers have strict quality controls and they will tell you that there is nothing in them which would disqualify you if you call and ask, but you still bear the risk.) Since supplements really are unnecessary and cannot replace hard work, being focused, disciplined, and dedicated, and eating a healthy balanced diet, don't waste your money on supplements. (Although I have to admit that I have "pissed away" a lot of supplements in my lifetime and have had some pretty expensive urine. I have since learned better. I also have wasted a lot of money on fast cars too. No regrets; lessons learned.)

I'm 14 and want to try some of these protein shakes. Does anybody have a recipe for a smoothie which includes both plenty of protein and carbohydrate and tastes good. I don't really want to start taking yeast and other supplements like that at this stage though

well i've always just used milkshakes with fruit and protein.

go get a tub of protein whatever it is mix that in.

leviathan wrote:I'm 14 and want to try some of these protein shakes. Does anybody have a recipe for a smoothie which includes both plenty of protein and carbohydrate and tastes good. I don't really want to start taking yeast and other supplements like that at this stage though

At 14, the last thing you need is a protein supplement. If you want to bulk up then just eat lots of hamburgers or pasta or both, and pump a lot of iron, row sprints and distance, run, cycle, etc. In other words, the typical 14 year old' diet supplies ample protein and carbohydrates. Just concentrate on exercise and eat whatever you want; you'll be fine.

If you want to be healthy, then just make the majority of your diet unrefined, whole plant-based foods, and limit the pizza, fast food, etc., but really if you exercise hard enough at 14, while you are still growing (hence, you should probably hold back on the weight lifting until 16, just build your body using your own body: pushups, pull ups, the daily dozen, etc.).

Throw some peanut butter or nuts in your fruit smoothie, and you'll get plenty of protein and healthy fat; otherwise just make the fruit smoothie.

If you are tempted to use a protein supplement, I recommend pea protein with a vanilla flavor; it mixes in a fruit smoothie nicely.

Absolutely bang on with that post Steelhead. When i was 14 i was a jr international track n' field athlete, our coach would never let us touch any weights. I am now 17, 94kg and pretty seriously into my rowing fitness training and i am still advised not to use any weights. As Steelhead said your bodyweight is plenty enogh and lots of circuit training, pushups, pullups etc. will do a lot more for you in the long run. As for protein shakes, all you need is to eat a healthy balanced diet, pleny of eggs fish and chicken and drink milk if you really require that much extra protein, it will also give you strong teeth and bones An excess of protein in your diet will do you no good anyway it will be released as waste or converted to fat, according to the nutritionist who advises me someone of your age and weighing 70 kg training for rowing should eat no more than 97g of protein everyday, anymore will be of no real long-term benefit, balanced diet, no weights, allow your body to develop naturally and i'll see you at the Olympics!

Owen