Concept2 Forum

Hi everyone,
I've started rowing about 1,25 years ago and have since then been rowing in a club. Now that winter is starting again, it's time to get back on the ergs. However I noticed myself getting sick one time after another, getting sick around 5 times in 3 months. This severely impacted my ability to really build up my endurance. I personally hate doing 2Ks, not for the pain it brings (atleast that isn't the main reason) but for the 2K being a constant reminder of me underperforming in my opinion. I'm not neccessarily tall nor heavy (5'7 134lbs 16M) although I still get thoroughly frustrated at me performing a sub 8:00 at best. I feel like I'm lacking behind everyone else and don't at all want to compete on the water for the fear of getting destroyed in races due to my underwhelming speed I can perform.

I really want to break my 2K plateau and improve my endurance to the point where a 7:40 would be possible (still a bad time imho but it's a monumental improvment to my current pace). Whilst I am somewhat less bad at 1hr I'd say (2:13-2:14, still not the best but I've never really went all-in for 1hr, usually just having a steady pace of around 2:15 and cranking down the speed in the last 10 minutes) I still am frustrated at how bad I perform at 2Ks and at similiar distances. Although I'm not really doing rowing as a competetive sport (go on larger regattas) I still want to somewhat improve myself at this.

Besides my rather weak endurance and leg strength, I also noticed my head being very weak. Prior to 2Ks, I can't sleep the entire night and I tend to have problems sleeping from 1 week prior to the 2K as I don't want to expierence the humiliation of performing bad on the 2K. I don't really know what to tell my trainer as whilst I enjoy the sport as a whole, I simply don't find myself good enough to go on regattas and stuff like that (and that is sort of an exclusion at my club). The diseases I have struggled with over the entire course of the year meant I missed two regattas and a 2K alongside weeks of training. It also makes me feel like all the time I'm spending on the water or the erg gets put down the gutter and I'm back to square 0.

Would it be useful for me to spend time training outside the regular training time to have more time for myself? How can I get my endurance back up from my sickness? How can I break this plateau?
(I'm sorry for my bad english, it isn't my native language and thanks for reading through this)

Hi,

I can't make any comments on the training side of things, as I'm not qualified/experienced & you've not given any idea of your current schedule.

But I will say, that I think your age is maybe causing you to be a little impatient, illnesses, especially ones that frequent, take a huge toll on the body, and it needs to recover before you can load it again. As a young person your recovery will be faster, but after long layoffs, you have to accept you do need to start from a place behind your previous PB's.
Just taking a couple of weeks out of regular training can have an impact, so 3 months is no surprise that you're not where you once were.

One other thing I took from your post, is your talk of humiliation and the anxiety that it's producing in you.

Any activity one takes part in, should be about enjoyment & if you're in a position where the thought of a 2K TT causes you to lose sleep for a week, IMO is not a position of enjoyment.

I'm also not sure where the humiliation is coming from: you're younger, smaller (height & weight) and firmly in the LWT category, and your pace is significantly faster than mine, even at your "bad" pace.

As a novice - some-one who has rowed between 6months -> 2 years - a time of 8:15 is the average pace of your age group over 2k at club level... just saying.

Who/what times/paces are you comparing yourself against to make you feel that what you're already achieving is a performance so poor that you should be humiliated by it?

TheXe wrote: ↑

December 20th, 2022, 4:57 pm

Hi everyone,
Would it be useful for me to spend time training outside the regular training time to have more time for myself? How can I get my endurance back up from my sickness? How can I break this plateau?
(I'm sorry for my bad english, it isn't my native language and thanks for reading through this)

Hi TheXe, Interesting post. Firstly m8 you are only 16 and starting out please don't be so hard on your self. As has been mentioned, not sure what your training is like but maybe I would guess you are over training and not eating enough. That is why you are getting ill every 3 months or so. You hit a peak and then crash. At 16 your body is a dynamo and burns up energy especially if you are getting anxiety.
We all compare our selves to others at 16, male and female alike and you have chosen a sport of giants so the mental effect will be far greater when you compare your self.
Please take control of your own training for a while, ignore the 2ks they are a mind bender to the untrained.
Just get on and row at a pace 20 or so secs slower than your 2k pace, do the 2.15s or so for distance. Get your volume and distances up and your calories.
Drink milk, full fat 2 pints a day. The fatty acids and tryptophan will sort out your anxiety. Look up keto diets and ignore the part about low carbs and just eat carbs as well, but not sugar carbs, pasta, potatoes, rice etc natural carbs.
Ignore silly supplements and all types of other faddy diets.
You need good standard miles on the rower and a small weights routine based on squat deadlift and bench, nothing else.
If you want to enter a regatta do it for fun because YOU want to not for the glory of the club. Trainers think that winning at your age is the be all and end all and totally screw peoples heads up.
Relax and enjoy the journey, it is about fun and bodily fitness at the end of the day. I would say aim for your hr rows or build up towards a half marathon. But set no time pace you will really enjoy it.

First of all, good that you are speaking out and seeking help.

TheXe wrote: ↑

December 20th, 2022, 4:57 pm

Besides my rather weak endurance and leg strength, I also noticed my head being very weak. Prior to 2Ks, I can't sleep the entire night and I tend to have problems sleeping from 1 week prior to the 2K as I don't want to expierence the humiliation of performing bad on the 2K.

As a former athlete, coach and manager of sport teams I must say this is a huge red flag to me. Terms like "humiliation" when losing a race are signals for me with a too big preoccupation with winning and pitentially a bad training environment. This level of anxiety blocks you from performing and feels unhealthy. A bit like writers block, but then for sports: your mind seems too occupied in "not failing" to allow you to excel.

TheXe wrote: ↑

December 20th, 2022, 4:57 pm

I don't really know what to tell my trainer as whilst I enjoy the sport as a whole, I simply don't find myself good enough to go on regattas and stuff like that (and that is sort of an exclusion at my club). The diseases I have struggled with over the entire course of the year meant I missed two regattas and a 2K alongside weeks of training. It also makes me feel like all the time I'm spending on the water or the erg gets put down the gutter and I'm back to square 0.

Please talk to your trainer and parents about your anxiety and what it does to you. Winning is a great feeling, but losing shouldn't hurt your self-esteem like this. Sport is intended as a positive thing. It should be fun. The fear of losing shouldn't keep you up at night. You sound like a smart guy and talking to someone you trust about the stress you get might help you a lot. You are much more than a guy with an oar, and life is more than races won. That is why many professional athletes actually have psychologists in their support team (see for example https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... l-21802423): to help them deal with this type of stress, to keep things positive. But a friend you trust can help as well.

As said above: illness can do a lot to your body. Especially when you are pushing your limits. So be gentle and realize that your body needs recovery time and good sleep.

Dutch wrote: ↑

December 21st, 2022, 7:31 pm

Hi TheXe, Interesting post. Firstly m8 you are only 16 and starting out please don't be so hard on your self. As has been mentioned, not sure what your training is like but maybe I would guess you are over training and not eating enough. That is why you are getting ill every 3 months or so. You hit a peak and then crash. At 16 your body is a dynamo and burns up energy especially if you are getting anxiety.

That is a very good point. Looking at the rest times between trainings and making sure the food contains decent building blocks to repair muscles are important indeed.

Hi again,

first off, I know that this sort of feeling of feeling not worthy with my 2K times and overall performance is really bad. In a way, I sort of adapted to this process of thinking by comparing myself to others, comparing their journeys to others and I know it's a really dumb thing if you think about it.

Who/what times/paces are you comparing yourself against to make you feel that what you're already achieving is a performance so poor that you should be humiliated by it?

Well, a plethera of things. Whilst it is crazy to see some people pull through 1:4X paces for an entire hour, it also is a sort of sad thought, something which after a few minutes I completely collapse at doing is being performed by someone who claims they've rowed for the same duration as I have and also make it appear easy. Although at my club, there isn't really some crazy person achieving that, there are some who can hold a 2:00 pace for an entire hour and are in the same age range as I am. The feeling of feeling so cut off compared to the rest is what is making me feel like I can't be proud of what I've achieved. I get this on the water aswell, although the problem on the water is mainly concerning my technique and is more making me angry than neccesarily sad.

As has been mentioned, not sure what your training is like but maybe I would guess you are over training and not eating enough. That is why you are getting ill every 3 months or so. You hit a peak and then crash. At 16 your body is a dynamo and burns up energy especially if you are getting anxiety.

Thinking about it, I have eaten a LOT less in the past few months. I originally attributed the fact that in over a year of growth I've not really made any significant body gain to me just losing a lot of fat and gaining muscle. However, especially with school being a b****, there are times where I don't have any real meal for up to 9 hours, except for some pastry at the bakery. With all the tests coming at once, sometimes I don't have the time or willingness to make myself dinner. When I was on vacation, I was initially shocked that I gained over 9lbs in such a short time, but during this time of 6 weeks, I haven't gotten sick once. Regarding injuries, I really don't want to spend two weeks not training at all, cause I enjoy the training and I do enjoy the sport. Whilst I eat pretty healthy stuff (don't got many sweets at home usually) I probably should prepare larger meals or add more carbs to them.

Regarding overtraining, I don't really think I am doing that. I attend the training 4 times a week during the winter, once on the water, once during a 1hr long jog/run, once on the erg for a hour or lifting weigths and another time on the weights, with more focus on stabilisation. Although I generally notice that initially during the runs and the rowing on the water, I am really having trouble, mainly in forearm and calf pain. Over time, it numbs down, even if the runs become more of a race to not puke on the sideways. Even though I run a 5:50-6:20 which I believe isn't the most taxing
time on the heart and lungs, I think it is because at the half mark, I make a small break which usually just leads to my stomach absolutely exploding and my cardiovascular system getting turned 180, maybe because the turn from running to standing still is too radical of a change. During the rows on the water, whilst I do feel that it is difficult to maintain it, I generally feel better the longer the row lasts. I feel like I can't use my legs properly however as besides the glutes, they don't really burn the same as they do on the erg. Speaking of, the erg is really just a matter of surviving the hour. The pain just slowly creeps in and I feel like the pace I'm rowing the hour is a managable one, I don't feel like I am really overtraining myself atleast there.

Please talk to your trainer and parents about your anxiety and what it does to you. Winning is a great feeling, but losing shouldn't hurt your self-esteem like this. Sport is intended as a positive thing. It should be fun. The fear of losing shouldn't keep you up at night.

I haven't talked to it about either of them to a large extend. I've told my trainers that I generally have a problem with my self-esteem and that I'm unhappy with my erg values and they've recognised that I am incredibly stressed from stuff like 2Ks but that's about it. I don't really know how to approach them on the matter that, atleast for the time being, I don't really want to be on Regattas or compete at all really. I enjoy the sport but as of rn I don't feel confident in being able to perform well, be it on the water or on the erg. I just would feel like a complete outcast, being the only one who doesn't want to row on regattas. And I kind of didn't really attend many regattas at all (4 in total, although I got sick prior to 2 regattas I was supposed to partake in). I just don't know how to tell them that I'm not the kind of person designed for this and that I don't like to feel completely unprepared prior to regattas. I kind of wanted to achieve atleast one win this year, and I believe that if I hadn't gone sick I probably could've won a race at atleast one regatta (I noticed my would-be opponents time being pretty slow) but I can't be certain obviously. I really don't like the feeling of 2Ks with lots of people behind one cheering them up, mainly because it puts an even larger pressure for me to not fail. I failed one once and I was completely broken from it mentally, even if before the race I was feeling like I was drowning in tears of sorrow for myself. Something which I'm still ashamed of me not finishing the last 300 or so meters, especially since my body didn't really give up, but my mind did.

I'd like to thank you for giving me some advice on how to tackle it and, atleast on the nutrition side of things I'll try to get more food in me. I'll tell the trainers about my erg fear and I'll try to somehow overcome that.

TheXe wrote: ↑

December 22nd, 2022, 1:42 pm

I'll tell the trainers about my erg fear and I'll try to somehow overcome that.

The good thing is erg fear is very trainable too. I highly recommend reading The Chimp Paradox by Dr Steve Peters. He was the Sky cycling psychologist and has really broken down, in a very accessible way, how and why the mind can be your worst enemy, and more importantly how to resolve it.

First of all, you need to retrain your perception towards 'failure'. You've not failed; it just didn't work and there is always something to take from it.

Break it all down into far smaller pieces, and analyse what is happening and what you can improve on. You will be improving, but you need to know what is working and what isn't. Nutrition is clearly a big issue for you, and it's good that you have identified that.

Keep us updated on your progress, and don't be afraid to say to us what your results are as we won't judge, as we fully understand the pain, sweat and fears involved in erging.

Dangerscouse wrote: ↑

December 22nd, 2022, 3:54 pm

The good thing is erg fear is very trainable too. I highly recommend reading The Chimp Paradox by Dr Steve Peters. He was the Sky cycling psychologist and has really broken down, in a very accessible way, how and why the mind can be your worst enemy, and more importantly how to resolve it.

Very good book apparently. My friend has bought it for his son who wants to become a pro boxer and is going through a problem with his performance and it is helping him.

I'm not neccessarily tall nor heavy (5'7 134lbs 16M) although I still get thoroughly frustrated at me performing a sub 8:00 at best.

Your English is fine. It's your Maths that's a disaster.

An 8' 2k is 200W, which on 134lb (61 kg) is 3.3W/kg and perfectly satisfactory at age 16.

An Olympic oarsman at 100kg might produce 500W in a 2k; so 5W/kg. But only for six minutes, not eight, and at age 20-25, not 16. Large strong people have a great advantage in rowing, because they don't have to climb hills.

The fastest cross country skiers and tour cyclists weigh 70kg max, which is a large advantage when you have to climb 3 to 5 km vertical in a single race.

jamesg wrote: ↑

December 23rd, 2022, 2:27 am

Your English is fine. It's your Maths that's a disaster.

An 8' 2k is 200W, which on 134lb (61 kg) is 3.3W/kg and perfectly satisfactory at age 16.

An Olympic oarsman at 100kg might produce 500W in a 2k; so 5W/kg. But only for six minutes, not eight, and at age 20-25, not 16. Large strong people have a great advantage in rowing, because they don't have to climb hills.

The fastest cross country skiers and tour cyclists weigh 70kg max, which is a large advantage when you have to climb 3 to 5 km vertical in a single race.

This, every time.