Steroids

[nchasan]

I am very curious...anybody on this forum using testosterone or other hormones? Steroids? Andro? Anything?

And if you are, can you share with us what your experience has been good and bad? thanks

Neil

[Bob S.]

I am very curious...anybody on this forum using testosterone or other hormones? Steroids? Andro? Anything?

And if you are, can you share with us what your experience has been good and bad? thanks

Neil

Cortisone. A number of years ago, I had injections for both wrist and elbow problems. In each case, it seemed to relieve the problem, but I had heard that continued cortisone use was hazardous, so I had only 3 or 4 at most. In recent years, my right knee has been giving me more and more trouble.

I had a long walking trip across Europe planned for the fall of last year, but my knee was getting worse and worse last summer and I was worried that I might have to cancel it. A visit to an orthopedic surgeon confirmed that there was little cartilage left and that the knee wasn't producing enough lubricant. The options were: 1) a quick fix cortisone injection. 2) injections of an artificial lubricant (hyaluronic acid - a polysaccharide with alternating glucose and glucosamine units and carboxylic acid side chains). 3) knee joint replacement. The knee replacement would have been the surest long term solution, but would require a long recovery period. There was not time for that, so I opted for the lubricant injections. However, I learned that there were three of those and they had to be taken at weekly intervals and it would be another 4 weeks before they would have full effect. By this time, it was less than a month before my scheduled flight, so the only viable option was the cortisone injection.

I had the cortisone injection about three weeks before the flight and got started on the walk in the waning days of August. It went O.K. for several weeks. I was carrying 20-25 pounds (food and water varying) and averaging about 10 miles a day. This went on for over 40 days, but my knee got progressively worse and I finally had to give it up about 70 miles short of my goal. I had also optimistically signed up for the BIRC for after the walk, but, by the time I quit the walk, I was in no condition to make a decent showing in an erg contest. I would have had to have help getting on and off the machine. So I cancelled all that and rescheduled an earlier flight home.

The trip home was harder on me than the walking. Too much sitting in busses and airplanes. After I got home, I had trouble just walking around the house for several weeks. I scheduled an appointment with the orthopedist to go ahead with the lubricant injections. There were come scheduling delays and it was 4-5 weeks before they were complete. I waited another 4 weeks, the usual wait for results from this procedure, but still did not feel that there was much improvement. In the 2-3 months since then, it has gotten better, but I still haven't done any walks longer than 5 miles. I have gotten back into using my model D indoor rower, but have only been doing my daily 10' wake-up rows, except for a couple of light workouts. Naturally I skipped the erg competitions this year, but I am hoping to make a go at it next year when I enter a new bracket. If I don't have any serious setbacks and they don't harden up the current soft qualifying time, I should have no trouble making it. I beat that time now once in a while in just my little wake-up rows and these are at 1200 meters of altitude. I can usually improve by 20-30" when I go to sea level.

My main problem now is that I would like to go back to complete that last 70 miles of the walk in Spain (Sarria to Santiago de Compostela). When I had first returned from the fall trip, I asked the orthopedist why there was such a sharp contrast, i.e. that I was able to do 10 miles a day with a moderate pack and, a week later, I could hardly hobble around the house. His answer was that it was probably combination of the effect of the cortisone shot wearing off at just about that time, motivation when I was actually on the road, and the distractions of meeting new people, staying in new places, and seeing the many changes since my previous trips 6 and 8 years before.

I still haven't decided whether or not to go. If I do, it will be in mid-spring and I will get another cortisone shot about a month before I go.

Bob S.

[ausrwr]

Neil, you'll excuse me, perhaps, if I'm a little curious about this.

I understand Bob's use of cortisone etc as an injury tool, and I've had to get a TUE for injected corticosteroid (it was a long while ago - within knee rehab), but as to why people would use testosterone and andro?

Can't really see the point. (Not of you asking the question, but of taking it in the first place).

[nchasan]

Neil, you'll excuse me, perhaps, if I'm a little curious about this.

I understand Bob's use of cortisone etc as an injury tool, and I've had to get a TUE for injected corticosteroid (it was a long while ago - within knee rehab), but as to why people would use testosterone and andro?

Can't really see the point. (Not of you asking the question, but of taking it in the first place).

I work with several older athletes who use steroids, andro etc to improve their performance etc. Many are treated here locally by a "longevity" clinic, and these guys swear that they feel years younger. I was wondering if any Eromaniacs have done similar things and notice changes in their performance....thats it.

N

[Bob S.]

I work with several older athletes who use steroids, andro etc to improve their performance etc. Many are treated here locally by a "longevity" clinic, and these guys swear that they feel years younger. I was wondering if any Eromaniacs have done similar things and notice changes in their performance....thats it.

N

Sounds like they are suffering from senile machismo, a common malady among older ex-athletes, including ergers.

Bob S.

[nchasan]

Sounds like they are suffering from senile machismo, a common malady among older ex-athletes, including ergers.

Bob S.

LOL, although the condition is correctly referred to as Andropause..you can read about it here "http://www.andropause.com"

N

[Bob S.]

Sounds like they are suffering from senile machismo, a common malady among older ex-athletes, including ergers.

Bob S.

LOL, although the condition is correctly referred to as Andropause..you can read about it here "http://www.andropause.com"

N

I was also speculating on the phrase "mid-life crisis." Is it the same or it is a precursor. Being at about double the common age for m-l c, I figure that in my case it must just be a precursor.

I also debated using the term "macho senility," but it just did not have the right ring to it.

Bob S.

[nchasan]

I also debated using the term "macho senility," but it just did not have the right ring to it.

Bob S.

I like the term... I think we need a new term to apply to A-Rod, or is it A-Roid?

[Nosmo]

You are talking about performance enhancing drugs! By most people's definition that is cheating if one competes!

PEDs certainly will make you faster if you can tolerate the side effects. EPO is also a drug of choice and probably much more effective then steroids for erg times. EPO now appears to be "miracle grow for cancers" http://tinyurl.com/b4wfg6

I frankly have a lot less tolerance for doping among amateur athletes then I do among the pros. From the few people I've spoken to it seems to be rampant among southern California bike races so I would not be surprised if there were ergers who used drugs also.

The idea of using HGH, and steroids for longevity seems pretty stupid to me. Sure you may feel better but I don't think the science is there to support longer life and it is very risky. Remember how doctors were prescribing hormones for menopausal women until it recently. It made the women feel younger, but it also killed a number of them and gave many more cancer.

Menopause and andropause are perfectly normal and people have been dealing with them for 100,000 years. They are not diseases or "conditions" needing treatment by the medical establishment.

"Senile machismo" -- I like the phrase.

Speaking of mid life crises there was a article a while ago, I think on the front page of the New York Times, where a psychologist came to the conclusions that they don't exist. The behaviors associated with midlife crises occur at all ages, it is just that people are more likely to be able to afford a Porsche when they get a bit older and trade in their wives when the wives are a bit older. The same behaviors occurs in 27 and 60 year old guys. He thought guys who do this were basically jerks. They were jerks when they were younger and usually remain after so after middle age. From what I've seen I have to agree.

Anyone taking drugs to win erg races is a complete jerk in my book.


(One last point about cortisone. It can be very effective and is often just what is needed to help one start to heal, but repeated injections very often lead to major problems. It may be wise to take it once or twice but if the problems come back, don't keep using it.)

[jliddil]

So should there be testing at CRASH B for example?

[jliddil]

http://www.thesteroidexperiment.com/blog/

[Citroen]

Menopause and andropause are perfectly normal and people have been dealing with them for 100,000 years. They are not diseases or "conditions" needing treatment by the medical establishment.

I think you're wrong on that. It's not that long ago that the average life expectancy wasn't long enough to allow old age to be a trigger for anything. It's only in the last couple of centuries that we've got over that hurdle.

Our ancestors didn't have to worry about that stuff as they'd be long dead long before it happened.

[Nosmo]

Menopause and andropause are perfectly normal and people have been dealing with them for 100,000 years. They are not diseases or "conditions" needing treatment by the medical establishment.

I think you're wrong on that. It's not that long ago that the average life expectancy wasn't long enough to allow old age to be a trigger for anything. It's only in the last couple of centuries that we've got over that hurdle.

Our ancestors didn't have to worry about that stuff as they'd be long dead long before it happened.

On average you are right. But a smaller percentage of people did live a long time. My point remains, it is not a medical condition--considering it so is a very recent cultural phenomenon.

[Carl Watts]

I don't need steroids I just read all the posts that Ranger sends to this forum, it's all the inspiration I need !