Concept2 Forum

Hi all, I'm just curious as to what kind of Heart Rate those of you who are fairly competitive rowers maintain during your row and for how long. Is there a certain forumula that states for maximum performance, you should row at "x" heart rate for "x" amount of time.

And when you were fairly new, how long did it take to get to a competitive level.

I've been rowing consistently for about 2 weeks now using row pro and do a half hour session at a 2:20/500m pace. My heart rate is usually 170-175 bpm (I'm 21) and it takes me about 2 days to recover fully after each session (is that normal for a newer guy). I don't know how some of you guys row 1-2 times a day every day

My goal is to pull a 2:00/500m. How long would you think a competive guy could shave off 20 seconds per 500 meters (or how long did it take you to shave off 20 seconds)?

Thanks
Travis

Everyone has a unique maxHR. There are formulae like 220-age but they're a very rough approximation and you could be 40bpm either side of a generalised method like that. My maxHR at age 44 was 205bpm.

The best way to find HR thresholds is to get a lab to do a lactate test (involves blood tests taken while you workout).

The next best way is a step test to failure. You row a sequence of 4:00mins with progressively higher number wattage until you reach a point where it's impossible to continue. That sort of test will get a good value for maxHR. But, you need to be fairly fit before attempting that sort of testing.

http://c2forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=7631 ... preadsheet will help with calculating your training bands once you have a maxHR value.

What you're experiencing is simply lack of fitness. It will come, but it takes time and it takes a lot of long 10K rows to build an endurance base. It's not possible to say whether 2:20/500m pace is suitable without your other vital stats (weight and height (we've got age and gender)). But it's a long way slower than most of the U23 folks that I've seen on the ergo.

A lot of us strive for 1:45/500m for the full 2000m. Some of the twenty and thirty year olds are looking at 1:30 pace. You'll get an idea of that from http://www.concept2.com/sranking03/rankings.asp or from the results from the CRASH-Bs.

travis1094 wrote:And when you were fairly new, how long did it take to get to a competitive level.

I've been rowing consistently for about 2 weeks now using row pro and do a half hour session at a 2:20/500m pace.

My goal is to pull a 2:00/500m. How long would you think a competive guy could shave off 20 seconds per 500 meters (or how long did it take you to shave off 20 seconds)?

Thanks
Travis

Travis, I started rowing last year and it took me from February until April to get under 2:00 pace for the 5K. I, however, am a 60 year old lwt and was recovering from Achilles surgery so at your age I would think it would be much faster. Take a look at the following logs from my last season to see how my times came down. I can now consistently pull under 2 for the 5k. last season If you keep at it your times will come down.

Travis, at age 62 it took me a year to get from 8½' to 7:10 for 2k.

However I could already row, having started 50 years before. If you do want to get fit, the first thing to do is learn to row - and the key to rowing is the stroke. Pretty obvious really, there's nothing else to do and nothing else will shift boats. So one at a time, let her go with no hurry to the next, long and relaxed strokes, where long is around 80% of your height. I pull 150cm overall, around 125 net and I'm 188cm (6'2). Short strokes (relative to your height) cannot be considered as rowing because they don't let you do any real work, however high the rating, so are useless from a fitness point of view.

Not knowing your height and weight, the only possible target index to suggest is Power/Weight ratio; if you aim at 2W/kg, and well above if athletically inclined, you'll get fit quick. Consider fit weight, not fat.

You should be sweating freely after about ten minutes, then keep going for another 20-30. Keep the rating down (so that you are forced to pull long hardish strokes), relax and use low drag, not more than 3.

If you use HR, use HR range, consider say 60-180 to be safe and stay within 65-80% (ie max 155-160). This will automatically update your power level as you get fitter, give you time to learn about your physiology and let you recover for tomorrow. Then once you're fit, you'll forget HR and work at a set pace or power.

My heart rate is usually 170-175 bpm (I'm 21) and it takes me about 2 days to recover fully after each session (is that normal for a newer guy).

You are pulling too hard, simple as that. Given your age, it should be possible to do 30' daily if you are at an appropriate pace. Jamesg and Citroen both provide good advice, but I'd side closer to Jamesg in your situation. Really, there is no need yet for fine tuning your HR zones. Sticking with approximations will be fine until you hit a steady fitness level. It can generally be assumed that keeping your HR between 140 and 155 is SS. For some this might be a little fast, others a little slow; but it is highly unlikely to be so far off the mark as to be deleterious. Just keep yourself within the rough HR zone and start building your volume up to 60' daily. You'll be hitting your goals before you know it.

thanks guys for sharing your personal experiences and I'll definitely take everything into consideration. I guess I will start just trying to get in shape first on the lower damper settings for a 30-40 minute session a day and try to get the cardio up a little before starting anything else. Thanks again.

travis1094 wrote:Hi all, I'm just curious as to what kind of Heart Rate those of you who are fairly competitive rowers maintain during your row and for how long. Is there a certain forumula that states for maximum performance, you should row at "x" heart rate for "x" amount of time.

And when you were fairly new, how long did it take to get to a competitive level.

I've been rowing consistently for about 2 weeks now using row pro and do a half hour session at a 2:20/500m pace. My heart rate is usually 170-175 bpm (I'm 21) and it takes me about 2 days to recover fully after each session (is that normal for a newer guy). I don't know how some of you guys row 1-2 times a day every day

My goal is to pull a 2:00/500m. How long would you think a competive guy could shave off 20 seconds per 500 meters (or how long did it take you to shave off 20 seconds)?

Thanks
Travis

Travis - what is your damper setting with your numbers? (2:00/500m). My damper is usually set at 4 and my numbers are 2:30/500m. I'm 62 years old so I guess I'm a little slower.

Thanks, Marvin

One workout my team had to do was 20min then 5 min rest, but you couldn't get off the erg you had to keep rowing very lightly, and we had to do this 3 times without getting off the erg once.

The second piece I kept my heart rate around a 180 for about 19 minutes, and then pushed it up to a 185-190 for the last minute. I didn't wear my HR monitor on the second piece.

Yeah, that's a standard AT workout with active rest. Good for experienced rowers, not appropriate for a brand new rower. Build the base, maybe do some low volume intensity, but hold off on high volume intensity until you can handle 5+ hours a week easily.

sheehc wrote:

My heart rate is usually 170-175 bpm (I'm 21) and it takes me about 2 days to recover fully after each session (is that normal for a newer guy).

You are pulling too hard, simple as that. Given your age, it should be possible to do 30' daily if you are at an appropriate pace.

I agree with this

sheehc wrote:Jamesg and Citroen both provide good advice, but I'd side closer to Jamesg in your situation. Really, there is no need yet for fine tuning your HR zones. Sticking with approximations will be fine until you hit a steady fitness level. It can generally be assumed that keeping your HR between 140 and 155 is SS. For some this might be a little fast, others a little slow; but it is highly unlikely to be so far off the mark as to be deleterious. Just keep yourself within the rough HR zone and start building your volume up to 60' daily. You'll be hitting your goals before you know it.

New to heart rates, but I did a sub 2:11 pace FM 6 months ago. At this pace my HR goes to around 170 after 20 mins. I tried slowing down (admittedly after 30 mins at 2:10), but couldn't keep under 160bpm even at 2:20 pace. So I am not sold that 140 - 155 is appropriate for all. I would just say that if you can still hold a conversation (if a little forced) and are sweating freely after 10 mins, the effort is not far off. Add that HR should only rise slowly after the first 15-20 mins. If it hasn't levelled off you need to slow a little.

Regards

Iain

I think the rate that you row and how quickly your rate conforms to that of others is too complex for easy answers. Depending on your baseline fitness when you started on the erg, or the type of exercise you were getting before, it could be very quick, or may never happen. If I were to be quizzed on this, I would recommend the development of an extensive base prior to worrying too much about getting the splits down to the 1:45 range. By putting in many days of 5-10K you will condition your ligaments and tendons to the particular strains, so that when you increase the rates and intensity your chances for injury will be lessened. It will also provide some aerobic base that will allow you to work harder. Much like learning to row on water, one has to develop a certain level of competence before any conditioning can take place. Granted, at your tender age massive improvement may be attainable in short order, but absent information about height, weight, resting heartrate and general condition, it's really impossible to make informed advice. And yet we all do. - Good luck

Why does it take two days to recover from a 2k at 170 somewhat bpm?

I think your stroke rate may be too high and not kicking hard enough. That was my problem in the beginning. Stroke rate mid 30's or higher?

It is actually easier to kick hard and slow the stroke rate down. Your times will improve.

Now I row daily, 6 days a week, at 47 yrs old, going up into the 160's for a comfort zone but mostly enjoying beating in the mid 150's @ around 8 1/2 minutes total per 2k @ around 29 strokes per minute, which are all comfortable numbers for me to do 6 days a week along with high repetition light weight training 5 days a week.

Developing your cardio and comfort zone heart bpm is better done slowly and build yourself up, making sure your rowing form is excellent. Don't try to go breaking records in the beginning. If you hurt your back, you will be out of commission for a while. Let your legs build up as they are doing the hardest part of the work. Learning to control your heartbeat and stay in your comfort zone is a skill you will naturally develop if you are doing everything else right. It is your heart that will get you to the end of the rowing workout time you select. A 2k should not need two days of recovery.

If anyone is interested here are the general heart rate zones used by top-athletes in Norway:

(percentages of max heart rate)
i1: 60-72%
i2: 72-82%
i3: 82-87%
i4: 87-92%
i5: 92-97%

Most training is done in the i1 and i2 workouts. A training consisting of for instance 3x8min intervals is usually done in i5 or i4. Some claim that i3 workouts are used way too much and only one such workout per week is required.