Concept2 Forum

For the last few years, I have been training with the assumption that, in the end, how fast you can row a 2K (and therefore how fast you can row any other distance, too) is almost entirely a matter of your natural stroking power.

Your natural stroking power can be measured in various ways:

(1) 500m @ 10MPS

(2) HMr18

(3) 30'r20

etc.

To calculate your natural stroking power, just figure the SPI (Stroke Power Index, watts/spm) for each of these tests.

It seems to me that, with few exceptions, the best rowers do a 2K at right around the same rate, with a loss of rate of one spm a decade after 20.

For instance, the best Open lightweights row a 2K at right around 36 spm, with that rate slipping to 32 spm by the time rowers are 60.

If we assume that, to do your best in a 2K, you have to relax and just pull normally, given this constant rate, how fast you are over 2K is entirely a product of how hard you normally pull, your natural stroking power.

Interestingly, your natural stroking power is strongly influenced by how well you row, how much power you get on each stroke, given some normal effort.

Techinique is a large issue.

If these assumptions are right, it seems to me that they have a large bearing on how to train for rowing.

In particular, given these assumptions, in training, what paces you achieve over some distance or set of distances is not as important as learning to take good strokes, the best ones you can, something the major rowing plans don't even mention.

The major training plans for rowing are all about paces and/or ratios, not stroking power.

Why?

ranger

In my personal experience, learning to row well is worth about 4 seconds per 500m.

That's 16 seconds in a 2K.

Quite a bit.

Seven years ago, when I rowed badly, I did a HMr18 @ 1:56.

That is 12.5 SPI.

Even though I am seven years older, I now do a HMr18 @ 1:52.

That is 14 SPI.

In terms of stroking power, my scores on 500m @ 10MPS (1:31 @ 33 spm) and 30'r20 (1:48) now are also 14 SPI.

Working with these assumptions about rowing and training for rowing, the goal of my training is to inch this stroking power up from 14 SPI to 15 SPI, which I think is at the limits of my potential, given my size (I usually walk around a bit heavier than 165 lbs., but I have raced about a dozen times as a lightweight; so I am not very big).

This will mean HMr18 @ 1:50, 30'r20 @ 1:46, and 500m @ 10MPS, 1:28 @ 34 spm.

ranger

ranger wrote:The major training plans for rowing are all about paces ...

Why?

Because that's how performances over the 10 distances are measured.

John Rupp wrote:

ranger wrote:The major training plans for rowing are all about paces ...

Why?

Because that's how performances over the 10 distances are measured.

That's racing, not trainiing.

You assume that the two are the same?

I don't assume this at all.

In fact, I assume just the opposite:

If you race your training, you never will row anywhere near your full potential.

ranger

Rowing badly, when I was 50 years old, I pulled 6:28 for 2K.

At 33 spm, 6:28 is 11.6 SPI.

At 14 SPI, a decline of 1 spm a decade is 14 watts.

If I were still rowing badly, when I am 60, the prediction would be that I would pull 6:32.

6:32 @ 32 spm is still 11.6 SPI.

Over the last five years, I have learned to row (and train) well.

If learning to row (and train) well is worth 4 seconds per 500m, the prediction would be that I would row 6:16 when I am 60.

6:16 @ 32 spm is 13 SPI, one SPI _below_ my present stroking power, now that I am rowing well, at 57.

It will be interesting to see how close I come to that.

The 60s hwt WR is Paul Hendershott's 6:23.7.

The 60s lwt WR is Brian Bailey's 6:42.5.

ranger

And your most recent 2k time is ?
And the one before ?
And the one before that one





Father time is not only affecting your brain

Even though I am seven years older, I now do a HMr18 @ 1:52.

No you don't - you are nowhere near such a performance.

You 'feel' based on rowing a few 'high-power' strokes that you are capable of such heroics but there are two reasons why you are woefully incorrect in this 'feeling'


1. You are stupid enough to make these idiotic pronouncements without actually attempting any decent proportion of your claimed piece. You can't manage a quarter of a full marathon at 1:52 R18 and if you were only to try you might learn something.

2. You are to physical self-assessment what King Herod was to babysitting.

ranger wrote:Rowing badly, when I was 50 years old, I pulled 6:28 for 2K.

That settles it then.

Rowing badly is the key to rowing faster.

ranger wrote: The major training plans for rowing are all about paces and/or ratios, not stroking power.
Why?
ranger

The power is not going to do you any good if you don't have the oxygen delivery systems in place to apply that power at a high rating.

ranger wrote: Even though I am seven years older, I now do a HMr18 @ 1:52

ranger

Oh really? When?

'In your dreams' doesn't count.

Yankeerunner wrote:

ranger wrote: Even though I am seven years older, I now do a HMr18 @ 1:52

ranger

Oh really? When?

'In your dreams' doesn't count.

Too difficult to answer?

Yankeerunner wrote:

Yankeerunner wrote:

ranger wrote: Even though I am seven years older, I now do a HMr18 @ 1:52

ranger

Oh really? When?

'In your dreams' doesn't count.

Too difficult to answer?

Anything "real" is to difficult for the deranged prof

Yankeerunner wrote:In your dreams' doesn't count.

You mean, you really have to do it?

ranger wrote: Your natural stroking power can be measured in various ways:

(1) 500m @ 10MPS

ranger

Could someone explain the importance of 10MPS?

Should most people try to do this in a 2K race?

thanks

kipkeino68 wrote:

ranger wrote: Your natural stroking power can be measured in various ways:

(1) 500m @ 10MPS

ranger

Could someone explain the importance of 10MPS?

Should most people try to do this in a 2K race?

thanks

No, it's a trainingtool. In races only pace matters, use whatever MPS you need.

Reason,

for a 6.oo rower 10 mps means he should use 200 strokes rate 33,33
a 7.00 rower 10 mps alos means 200 stokes so he should rate 28.6
a 8 min rower should rate 25
etc.

This fixed rate is ofcause not the way to go. Use the rate that gives you te best result's