Concept2 Forum

I train 3 (occasionally 4 ) times a week, am male, 57kg and 5ft8.
I know I’m never gunna be an olympian but would love some insight regarding the famous 2K.

Attached is my pb. Strategy wise, how does it look? Any observations, stroke rate or anything would be appreciated. Also any tips to improve.

I did one a few weeks before, avg rate 27 and got a 7:49.2 so I don’t know if that means anything.

Thanks

Sadly nothing attached to your post. You're doing fine for your size and on 3 or 4 sessions per week. Without the further data, hard to say much more other than rate 27 for a 2k for a relatively smaller person is low. Most of us try to get into the low 30s for a 2k (even the giants) and lightweights often well into the 30s. But not everyone, so its not going to be a silver bullet.

To evaluate your time it depends upon how long you have been training and what other sports you do and your age. Otherwise I would agree that you could probably improve most by getting used to maintaining a higher rating. The other point is how the 2k progressed. Quoting the separate "splits" within the 2k would show whether your pacing could be better. But most men aim for a sub 8 min 2k as their first big target, so well done from completely smashing that.

rate 27 and got a 7:49.2 - 57kg - 15y

7:49 is 220Watt, so at rate 27:

Stroke work = 220/27 = 8 Watt-minutes
and 220/57 = 3.9 W/kg.

Which certainly looks good for a 2k at age 15 and 57kg. I'd guess you had it under control, so could do well in stroke seat. Times for 13-18y LW/2000m age range can be seen in the C2 rankings. There will be full records for year 2024, but only a few for 2025 (which started May 1st 2024). There you can seen the progress typical for that age range and times for your cohort.

If you must do a 2k or longer, take it easy. A 2k TT is best done after a good warmup and at constant pace. Pacing depends on experience, but if we start slowish and then check what's going on after the first 500m we can usually finish hard, as if in a race.

As a similar weight male (61kg) albeit much older, I found that as I got fitter the stroke rate crept up naturally.

Hi all

Newbie rower here looking for some pacing advice. Just completed my first 2k test but feel my pacing was not optimal: overall time 8:35 with the following splits 2:11.7, 2:11.1, 2:09.9, 2:02.2.

I feel my first three 500s were a bit slow compared to my final 500m. At 300m to go i went flat out at around 1:58 pace.

My question really is how could i have paced this better based on the fact I could accelerate so much in the final 300m (i was flat out)? Could i for example have have started at 2:05 and maintained that for the whole thing. I was comfortable at 2:11 with 23 spm.

Thank you in advance for your advice

Jamie

Negative splits (gradually decreasing times) and sprinting the last X00 meters is a very common strategy, so there's nothing terrible about that. If you want to push a bit harder at the start you could take a few seconds off your splits and see what happens. Yes, it's more efficient to use the same pace for the entire piece, but psychologically that never works for me. As always, beware of the dreaded "fly and die."

And finally, congratulations on your first one!

Thanks for the reply Ombrax. Looking back i think i could have picked up the pace at least a few hundred metres earlier. I was rowing somewhat conservatively the first two splits then picked up a :
little inthe 3rd but still controlled. It was only with 300 to go that i went flat out. I think i could have kept the 2:00 pace for around 500 so could have gained a few seconds overall. I did 3x1000 at 2:10 pace a few weeks ago and that felt pretty hard 8/10 rpe especially on the 3rd set. So felt 2:10 would be a decent but doable pace for the first 1500 of the 2k test. In a few weeks i plan to go at 2:06-8 for the first 1500 next time then let rip the final 500. As you rightly mentioned i dont want to go out too quick; Ive made that mistake in running events in the past.

Thanks again for taking the time to respond

Jamie rowing wrote: ↑

June 29th, 2024, 5:53 am

I was comfortable at 2:11 with 23 spm.

This is probably also something to look at. 23spm is very low for a 'race' to go fast.
Everyone has a sweet spot of rate for a given distance, but I wouldn't assume yours (or anyone else's) is at 23. Typical value for a 2k is around 30, some use a bit lower rate, some bit higher even going into 40s.
Surely this is also something what needs to be trained to get used to the higher rate, as breathing is affected by rate as well.

Yes that is agood point. Looking back to when i did 7*500/2r i was pulling spm 28 at 2:08 pace on average. So will look to do something similar for my next 2k. I was basically far too conservative at first, worried out flying and dying. This is the learning curve. Hopefully with a few more attempts i can produce a better time. My target is to get below 8 minutes for 2k within the next couple of months. Improved rowing technique and race strategy should get me a little closer, plus the gradual improvement in fitness. I am generally pretty fit but have been focusing on strength training formmost of the last six months, so i still have some ‘newbie’ fitness gains to look forward to with my new focus on rowing.

Thanks for your input

Jamie rowing wrote: ↑

June 29th, 2024, 4:57 pm

In a few weeks i plan to go at 2:06-8 for the first 1500 next time then let rip the final 500. As you rightly mentioned i dont want to go out too quick; Ive made that mistake in running events in the past.

Sounds like you have a sensible plan and strategy, ultimately questions along the lines of "could I hold X pace for X time" are just going to be answered with guess work. A couple of splits a second may not sound much on paper, but they soon become very fine margins. Based on your final 300m though, that's a solid indication you set out a little conservatively for a test piece. I certainly couldn't sprint for 300m at the end of a 2k test.

Jamie rowing wrote: ↑

June 30th, 2024, 1:45 am

Yes that is agood point. Looking back to when i did 7*500/2r i was pulling spm 28 at 2:08 pace on average. So will look to do something similar for my next 2k. I was basically far too conservative at first, worried out flying and dying. This is the learning curve. Hopefully with a few more attempts i can produce a better time. My target is to get below 8 minutes for 2k within the next couple of months. Improved rowing technique and race strategy should get me a little closer, plus the gradual improvement in fitness. I am generally pretty fit but have been focusing on strength training formmost of the last six months, so i still have some ‘newbie’ fitness gains to look forward to with my new focus on rowing.

Thanks for your input

Absolutely what you say. The more TTs you make, the more you get to know your abilities and you can adjust your race plan to it.
My last 2k was really flat in pacing throughout, as I was riding the fine line between max output and crashing It takes time until you know your capabilities that good to be on this edge for the complete race and not burn before reaching the end

It's difficult to pace when you don't know roughly what your result will be. But now you've logged one you can start to hone your pacing in (of course as you get fitter it's a moving target). I went for flattish conservative times for the first 1500 and then an all out last 500. If I paced really well that planned for all out last 500 became by necessity an all out 250 or 300.

Always remember it's much easier on the mind to start conservatively and speed up than it is to waste yourself early and have to drag ass over the finish line (what some call 'fly and die'.

Another thing often said is that if you don't feel on the verge of giving up at 1k then you are not going fast enough lol.

Jamie rowing wrote: ↑

June 30th, 2024, 1:45 am

Yes that is agood point. Looking back to when i did 7*500/2r i was pulling spm 28 at 2:08 pace on average. So will look to do something similar for my next 2k. I was basically far too conservative at first, worried out flying and dying. This is the learning curve. Hopefully with a few more attempts i can produce a better time. My target is to get below 8 minutes for 2k within the next couple of months. Improved rowing technique and race strategy should get me a little closer, plus the gradual improvement in fitness. I am generally pretty fit but have been focusing on strength training formmost of the last six months, so i still have some ‘newbie’ fitness gains to look forward to with my new focus on rowing.

Thanks for your input

The newbie stages of rowing can be a bit of a minefield as you necessarily need to experiment just to see what is possible, but you might be trying on a good or bad day and consequently get a skewed result that influences your thoughts.

Definitely get used to higher stroke rates, but take your time over it as the subtle oxygen debt will take a toll on you as it unknowingly builds up. Try and do increasing bursts of distance or time, with increases as you feel more comfortable.

What drag factor are you using, and have you experimented with that to find where you're the most efficient?

Erg fitness is a bit different from normal fitness, so it does take time to build, especially as you can be leaking power through poor technique. For a seemingly simple exercise it is surprisingly difficult.

The damper was set on 4. Not actually sure what drag factor that equals. I have used this number since I started back in April. I’ve read that most rowers should have it on between 4 and 6. I figured that becuase i am relatively light and short compared to most rowers, i should keep the number on the low end. Is that something that would be worth experimenting with?

Also, why do people use the term and number for drag factor rather than saying the number the the side of the machine?

Thanks in advance