Concept2 Forum

I'll make this as concise as possible but I have been reading a ton on rowing and this forum and I just keep getting sucked down rabbit holes and now there's so much more information I don't understand.

I am 38 Female that is short 5'2". I quit drinking in December and decided to get my life back. I started rowing December 30 and I have been doing the WODs for two months. I check the honor board, when I started I was in the 45-50 percentile for Female. Now I'm averaging in the top 7-13 percentile in female on the wods. February goals were row 100k, get to 200k lifetime meters and row every day whether it was 250m or more(I know I need rest but I like a challenge and competition.

I saw the BPP mentioned on here and have looked into it and read some other posts on this forum but for steady state everyone on here is saying s/m is in the teens maybe up to 20. I tried that on a 5000m row last night and after I finish pulling I feel like I just sit there for 2+ seconds before coming forward again to start my next stroke. Is this normal or is it because I'm so short my strokes don't take as long? Last nights row for steady state was average 2:25.1, 24s/m(after 500m I increased my s/m from 20 to 24), 114 watts. If anyone can help explain some of this it would be greatly appreciated and if this has been hashed out in other threads please point me in the right direction. I have spent hours reading here but I haven't found anything that explains what I'm confused about.

My other question that is sort of related is my split times and s/m in the wods. I did 3 4 5 4 3 min with 2 minutes rest between 1/10 and 3/15
1/10/24 4052 meters 2:20.6, 31 s/m, 126 watts
3/15/24 4412 meters 2:09.1, 29 s/m, 162 watts
is this a decent improvement in my ability? I don't understand watts. I typically look at my splits. the s/m should they be lower?

Again I'm sorry if this is somewhere else or asked 1000 times.

MegRyder wrote: ↑

March 21st, 2024, 12:12 am

I'll make this as concise as possible but I have been reading a ton on rowing and this forum and I just keep getting sucked down rabbit holes and now there's so much more information I don't understand.

I am 38 Female that is short 5'2". I quit drinking in December and decided to get my life back. I started rowing December 30 and I have been doing the WODs for two months. I check the honor board, when I started I was in the 45-50 percentile for Female. Now I'm averaging in the top 7-13 percentile in female on the wods. February goals were row 100k, get to 200k lifetime meters and row every day whether it was 250m or more(I know I need rest but I like a challenge and competition.

I saw the BPP mentioned on here and have looked into it and read some other posts on this forum but for steady state everyone on here is saying s/m is in the teens maybe up to 20. I tried that on a 5000m row last night and after I finish pulling I feel like I just sit there for 2+ seconds before coming forward again to start my next stroke. Is this normal or is it because I'm so short my strokes don't take as long? Last nights row for steady state was average 2:25.1, 24s/m(after 500m I increased my s/m from 20 to 24), 114 watts. If anyone can help explain some of this it would be greatly appreciated and if this has been hashed out in other threads please point me in the right direction. I have spent hours reading here but I haven't found anything that explains what I'm confused about.

My other question that is sort of related is my split times and s/m in the wods. I did 3 4 5 4 3 min with 2 minutes rest between 1/10 and 3/15
1/10/24 4052 meters 2:20.6, 31 s/m, 126 watts
3/15/24 4412 meters 2:09.1, 29 s/m, 162 watts
is this a decent improvement in my ability? I don't understand watts. I typically look at my splits. the s/m should they be lower?

Again I'm sorry if this is somewhere else or asked 1000 times.

Hi Meg, first of all these are good questions so don't worry.

Your height will definitely cause you some issues if you lower the stroke rate, as you'll naturally finish sooner than I would (I'm 6'4") due to limb and torso length.

Choose a stroke rate that allows you to have a continuous flow, but this should also be supplemented with a conscious decision to slow down the recovery phase too. This may be r24 or higher so just let if be whatever it is as if you're pausing too long the stroke becomes disjointed and jerky, so you'll probably have a higher risk of injury. It's worth noting that Pete Marston (who developed the Pete Plan) rows his steady sessions at r24.

Ideally, you want the drive phase to be the same speed, or close to it, for almost every session and the recovery is what slows down. Your power per stroke will also reduce or increase accordingly if you're wondering how that can happen.

That's great progress and there's nothing wrong with your stroke rate, especially as you've rowed further with less strokes.

MegRyder wrote: ↑

March 21st, 2024, 12:12 am

I'll make this as concise as possible but I have been reading a ton on rowing and this forum and I just keep getting sucked down rabbit holes and now there's so much more information I don't understand.

I am 38 Female that is short 5'2". I quit drinking in December and decided to get my life back. I started rowing December 30 and I have been doing the WODs for two months. I check the honor board, when I started I was in the 45-50 percentile for Female. Now I'm averaging in the top 7-13 percentile in female on the wods. February goals were row 100k, get to 200k lifetime meters and row every day whether it was 250m or more(I know I need rest but I like a challenge and competition.

I saw the BPP mentioned on here and have looked into it and read some other posts on this forum but for steady state everyone on here is saying s/m is in the teens maybe up to 20. I tried that on a 5000m row last night and after I finish pulling I feel like I just sit there for 2+ seconds before coming forward again to start my next stroke. Is this normal or is it because I'm so short my strokes don't take as long? Last nights row for steady state was average 2:25.1, 24s/m(after 500m I increased my s/m from 20 to 24), 114 watts. If anyone can help explain some of this it would be greatly appreciated and if this has been hashed out in other threads please point me in the right direction. I have spent hours reading here but I haven't found anything that explains what I'm confused about.

My other question that is sort of related is my split times and s/m in the wods. I did 3 4 5 4 3 min with 2 minutes rest between 1/10 and 3/15
1/10/24 4052 meters 2:20.6, 31 s/m, 126 watts
3/15/24 4412 meters 2:09.1, 29 s/m, 162 watts
is this a decent improvement in my ability? I don't understand watts. I typically look at my splits. the s/m should they be lower?

Again I'm sorry if this is somewhere else or asked 1000 times.

No silly questions here....so ask away.

And 5'2" is possitvely huge......my wife is 4'11" and rows
She is not really inetersted in performance or gains and it just using it for weight loss/fitness but some of the things you mention above resonate. Stroke length will natuarally be shorter and lower rates may well feel strange. So find what works for you as Stu says as it will make the process far more enjoyable. If you haven't already look into the drag factor too as my wife found it better to be on a higher setting as her stroke is much shorter whereas I am around 115 DF. If Drag Factor is alien to you there are lods of discussions about it on here but below is a link to the C2 101 on it.

https://www.concept2.com/indoor-rowers/ ... etting-101

I'd say you are making great progress so far so stick with it and more will come.

I'm sure others will have more to add too.

MegRyder wrote: ↑

March 21st, 2024, 12:12 am

I quit drinking in December and decided to get my life back.

YES! So pleased for you. I am 13 months sober and cutting out that poison from your life is the best decision you will ever make (also helps with training!). Congratulations and keep at it!

Hi and welcome

Pace - split time/500m and power are displaying the same things in a different fashion - it is not a linear curve, and so as power increases the rate of increase of split times drops. (https://www.concept2.com/indoor-rowers/ ... calculator - plug in some numbers and have a look to get a better understanding)
Some people prefer one metric over the other - I like to use both simultaneously.

The main reason stroke rate plays a part is that there's a balance with how powerful your stroke is, and how many strokes you take when going at the same pace/power when it comes to how efficiently your body is able to perform.

in pure numbers using 200W as the example
200/20spm = 10Wmins - in 20 strokes this person will have generated 200W end HeartRate 150bpm
200/25spm = 8Wmin - in 25 strokes this person will have generated 200W end HR 150bpm

Person A took fewer more-powerful strokes, person B took more less-powerful strokes - but they both generated the same power with the same physiological response at the end. There's a few assumptions made in the example, but hopefully it illustrates things for you.

This is relatively easy to verify with a Heart rate monitor and a specific pace/power over a moderate time 10-30mins by doing it at different rates to monitor the HR. Things like how quickly it peaks, and what the peak values are, are the key trends. But also how it feels is important too.

When you find the rate that suits you, it will just flow, as Stu says - it'll feel easy, controllable and repeatable with relative consistency stroke to stroke. Your breathing will settle into a routine and it just is a "nice" place to be; when not going flat out!

In my first year, I found that more weaker strokes suited me better from a HR perspective. But the cost of that was for the shorter distances I could not rate up much more & generate additional pace needed to make some larger gains. (form/technique & strength related)
I spent around 6 months training a more powerful stroke - getting my body to adapt to this different effort profile - and I've since seen some big gains in my pbs as a result.

My "natural" easy flowing rate for the longer stuff has dropped from around 28->23/24.

A final point - is that if you can think of the rowing stroke as a push (with the legs) rather than a pull with the arms, it will help you focus on the drive phase, which is where the most power is generated & thus helps with creating a more efficient stroke. The legs being bigger muscles can do more work more easily.

1/10/24 4052 meters 2:20.6, 31 s/m, 126 watts
3/15/24 4412 meters 2:09.1, 29 s/m, 162 watts
is this a decent improvement in my ability? I don't understand watts. I typically look at my splits. the s/m should they be lower?

That looks very good, so well done. At height 5'2 (1.57m) and guessed fit weight 55-60kg that's well over 2W/kg.

The Watt is a measure of Power, and power is force x speed. Erg pace is derived from the average Power measured by the the erg, converting to Speed and Pace using a cube law (W = 2.8 V³ with V in m/sec), which means that to go twice as fast we need to produce eight times as much Power.

My estimate of the power needed to pump blood and breathe air and so stay alive is about 20W, and you are producing up to eight times that much. Can't fail to get fit, as your numbers show.

I use low stroke rates for training, so that I can keep the stroke relatively strong; evidently you don't have to. But if you want to do very long rows you may need to reduce power, which is usually done by reducing the rating. It helps if we manage to find a comfortable rhythm.