Running and rowing equivalents

[run&row]

Hello,
I am a mid distance track runner with PR's of 52 (400m), 2:00 (800m) and 4:40 (1 mile). I am injured currently but rowing does not seem to aggravate it. For those who are well versed in both erg rowing and running, what are some equivalent performances and distances on the erg? Recently did 1:34 500 and 7:26 2k with about 1 min rest between each. What should I be aiming for? sub 1:30/sub 7? quicker? different distances?

[johnlvs2run]

There is no good relation between running and rowing.
The movements are totally different. Thus rowing is most likely harmful to running.
Using an elliptical or arc trainer would be more helpful for running, and a bike would be better than rowing.

[alex9026]

I wouldn't concern yourself with trying to find comparable times, you're a strong runner who presumably (feel free to tell me otherwise) isn't well versed to rowing. Treat it as two different sports, a cross training approach to maintain some base CV fitness will differ to a sub "insert figure here" 2k time trial.

[alex9026]

Thus rowing is most likely harmful to running.
Using an elliptical or arc trainer would be more helpful for running, and a bike would be better than rowing.

What do you base this on? In my own experience, rowing served as fantastic cross training in my running days.

[Kerry1960]

In terms of running / rowing and required equivalent anaerobic/aerobic fitness I would say :

Running 400 = erg 500
Running 800 = erg 1k
Running 1500 = erg 2k

Just my opinion

[gvcormac]

When I was 35, my running and rowing 10km were pretty similar: in the 40 minute range. Maybe rowing a couple of minutes faster.

I cross-trained 30km rows and runs for marathon (3:40).

30+ years later, my running 10k time is 53:something and my rowing time 41:something.

Same body weight. Same effort (90%+ max HR).

[ranger]

Rowing and running are WILDLY different. Many rowers can't run at all; most runners are bad at rowing. Rowing (done well) and running use antithetical muscles and body types. The most important thing in rowing is "swing," a big arcing movement of the back forward and back, powered by the core muscles. Rowing also makes considerable use of the upper body, especially the lats, pulling into the finish. Biking uses neither of these. Rowing DOES make considerable use of the legs but in ways that are pretty different from running. Rowers tend to be big, heavy, and strong. Runners tend to be small, light, and weak. Why? Running is done against gravity. Rowing is done sliding up and down a rail; gravity isn't an issue. I was a marathon runner for 25 years after college, but at 50 years old got too heavy as I aged and hurt my achilles tendon. At that point, I couldn't run very well at all. I ran 2min for 800m in high school, but I suspect I couldn't have even done 2:30 when I was 50 years old. On the other hand, when I took up rowing at 50, I was an instant success, breaking the 50s lwt 2K WR three times when I was 52, pulling 6:28 for 2K. Rowing and running are both power and endurance sports, though, so both make crucial use of a high aerobic capacity and so can be used as cross-training for each other. I have always taken advantage of this.

[RWAGR]

On the other hand, when I took up rowing at 50, I was an instant success, breaking the 50s lwt 2K WR three times when I was 52, pulling 6:28 for 2K.

Is this the infamous Ranger who is (or was?) banned for life from this site?

Appears not much has changed: https://www.reddit.com/r/Rowing/comment ... ing_group/

[nick rockliff]

Rowing and running are WILDLY different. Many rowers can't run at all; most runners are bad at rowing. Rowing (done well) and running use antithetical muscles and body types. The most important thing in rowing is "swing," a big arcing movement of the back forward and back, powered by the core muscles. Rowing also makes considerable use of the upper body, especially the lats, pulling into the finish. Biking uses neither of these. Rowing DOES make considerable use of the legs but in ways that are pretty different from running. Rowers tend to be big, heavy, and strong. Runners tend to be small, light, and weak. Why? Running is done against gravity. Rowing is done sliding up and down a rail; gravity isn't an issue. I was a marathon runner for 25 years after college, but at 50 years old got too heavy as I aged and hurt my achilles tendon. At that point, I couldn't run very well at all. I ran 2min for 800m in high school, but I suspect I couldn't have even done 2:30 when I was 50 years old. On the other hand, when I took up rowing at 50, I was an instant success, breaking the 50s lwt 2K WR three times when I was 52, pulling 6:28 for 2K. Rowing and running are both power and endurance sports, though, so both make crucial use of a high aerobic capacity and so can be used as cross-training for each other. I have always taken advantage of this.

Hi Rich, it's been a long time! How are you keeping?

[WayHand]

I run and row and find rowing great for improving fitness.
One way to compare is to look at age-graded percentages for both sports.
For rowing scores worth having a look at the Nonathlon competition, which will give you a good indication of age graded rowing performance.

[Yankeerunner]

Hello,
I am a mid distance track runner with PR's of 52 (400m), 2:00 (800m) and 4:40 (1 mile). I am injured currently but rowing does not seem to aggravate it. For those who are well versed in both erg rowing and running, what are some equivalent performances and distances on the erg? Recently did 1:34 500 and 7:26 2k with about 1 min rest between each. What should I be aiming for? sub 1:30/sub 7? quicker? different distances?

If your intention is to remain a runner, and use the rower until your injuries heal and you can get back to running, I wouldn't worry about the times that you're doing. Row by perceived effort, regardless of pace. If your running program called for a long aerobic workout, do roughly the same amount of time on the rower at a pace that feels much like your running pace. If your running program called for repeat 400s, do 300s on the erg at an effort that would be similar to how you feel doing 400 on the track. If a 'tempo' or anaerobic threshold workout, a 5K or 6K at whatever effort you'd put into the tempo run.

I took up the erg after several decades of competitive running, and the thing I liked best about it was that I could simulate the kind of intensity that I had put into running workouts. The two don't mix particularly well as far as competition goes. I find that I can't satisfy two mistresses at the same time. I've got to either prepare to run races while using the erg for cross-training, or prepare for erg races with only a minimum of running for cross-training. Both sports have been highly satisfying for me, but I can't concentrate on competitions in both at the same time.

[Mike Caviston]

For those who are well versed in both erg rowing and running, what are some equivalent performances and distances on the erg?

Rowing and running are pretty different activities; success at one doesn’t really predict success at the other; the relationships between times for similar running/rowing distances vary considerably from one athlete to the next due to a variety of factors (age, size, training history, etc.) BUT rowing and running can complement each other in a training program. Rick (Yankeerunner) is probably the most experienced and accomplished runner on this forum, so I would listen closely to his advice regarding using the rowing machine while rehabbing from your running injury. If you eventually discover you have some potential at rowing, and get the competitive bug, just to give you some perspective, I have been able to compete successfully in both activities at the same time. Of course, my top speed at each suffers somewhat, but I find that when I’m doing well at one I’m doing well at the other. About 10 years ago, I raced a 2K on the erg, and the next day ran a marathon. Both results qualified me for Boston (back when the CRASH-B regatta in Boston was the indoor world championship). I've managed to get on the podium at both rowing and running events in the same month many times since then.

[Cyclingman1]

I have many decades of experience in running and cycling and about twelve years in rowing. A few thoughts/observations. Running is definitely the hardest of the three, though that is colored by the fact that I was big runner, around 192 lb. The fitness level achieved in running translates directly to the other two. I don't think the non weight bearing of cycling and rowing translates all that well to running - the legs are not trained in the same way. No doubt that heavy cycling slowed me down for running, though endurance level was still there. I was not a great runner, but was pretty successful in duathlons: run,bike,run, typically 5K,40K,5K.

What is interesting is how close my running times from the past are very close to my rowing PRs of the last decade. My 10Ks of 36:20 are virtually the same in both and my running 5K is slightly below my 17:34 in rowing. My 5:20 mile during duathlon yrs is nearly identical to my 6:40 2K row PR. I was done running when I started rowing, so I cannot directly address whether rowing helps running, but I think not. OTOH, no doubt that my yrs of duathlon competition helped me immensely when I started rowing. I started in Jan, 2012 and by Apr, 2012, age 66, I was already below the current 65+ 2K WR.

I should note that hard running, lots of 440 track intervals, etc eventually killed my legs. That is why I have hardware in both hips and dysfunctional knees. No problem cycling or rowing.

[ranger]

.

Hi Rich, it's been a long time! How are you keeping?

Cheers, Nick. Everything MY way in great. I have been retired for 10 years. I now have two grandkids. My health is fine. My fitness is high. And it seems that I have finally found the rowing stroke I have been looking for (what is called a CONIBEAR stroke). So, this winter, I will take up racing again. My wife and I are in the process of moving from Michigan to Door County, Wisconsin, where I am building a house on some land my family has owned for a long time. So these are exciting times for us. I haven't been rowing my 1xs much lately, but I have been doing double sessions now on the erg and bike on a daily basis, without missing a day, ever since I retired in 2013.

[mjhatten]

I used to run until my knees started to betray me. I started erging, walking, and exercise biking to take its place. I wanted to find some way to establish rough equivalence between the exercise I used to get with running with the exercise I get now. The common denominator I found was Mets and time.

For the Concept 2, I used this formula, METS=Calories per hour / 60 *200 / Wt (Kg) / 3.5. I get the calories per hour from my PM3 log.

Then I check the Compendiium of Physical Activites (Google for list) for the Met values for running at different speeds. Then I run a ratio to get my equivalent minutes by this formula -- equivalent running minutes = exercise mets / running equivalent mets * exercise time. Then I use the equivalent running minutes to calculate an equivalent running distance.

The ACSM has a fomula for calculating running mets if you want to do more math. Google for details