Concept2 Forum

Hello rowers,

Today I did a 6x500m with 2' rest.
My pace target was 1:49, a pace that would improve my 2k PB (I plan a TT in the next month or so).

My splits :
1:49.2
1:48.9
1:49.0
1:48.9
1:49.0
1:48.9

Spot on, and at the end I felt that I could still have done some hundreds of meters more, maybe a full 7th interval, at the same pace.

So my question is : does this kind of session can be used as a 2k predictor?
Should I be able to row a 1:49.0 2k?

I'm primarily a runner and some training sessions can be used as 5k/10k time predictors.

Thanks!

No, I don't think this session can be used as a predictor. It doesn't show to what extend you were challenged. It would be more useful if you had added the HR's at the end of each split.

Maybe splitting hairs on language, but I think this may have some indicative if not predictive use for the OP. I believe a 6x500 2r piece can be done at around 2k -2or3 pace. The question asked is if this piece predicts doing a 2k at 1:49. Answer no it doesn't. But it does suggest you should be able to do it at 1:51/2. Of course there's endless reasons why that might not work out in either direction, but it is a "known" indicator for many. I would suggest setting off at 1:51 and wind it up in the last 500 if there's anything left in the tank.

When I was training properly for 2k races I found that the Mike Caviston guidance held good for me - 8 x 500 at 5min starts and 4 x 1k at 10 min starts can be done at 2k pace.
I constantly found that those sessions at flat out even pace over the whole set was the 2k pace I could do at that time, with very little, if anything left in the tank for the last 200m.

Your current PB is already a 1:50 split, so 1:49 is very near. Did you train intensively for an improvement?

Imo, six reps isn't enough to make you really feel what to expect when it is only 500m. The discomfort is too short-lived for a lot of people to transpond to a 2k. The third 500m in a 2k TT is where you'll win or lose, and that can need a lot of attention.

Persinally, I'd recommend doing 750m+, and ideally 1k+ as the mental battle is far better challenged in these sessions. There is no downside to this too, as if you also produce the desired result it's a confidence boost and it's a good way of feeling the difference between, say, 500m and 1k when it's really starting to bite.

37 HWT (182cm-6' / 80kg-176lb) Should I be able to row a 1:49.0 2k?

Easily. Will depend on technique though. What rating (stroke per minute) did you use in the intervals?

Suggest you train at 200W and rate 20 for a while.

jamesg wrote: ↑

January 29th, 2023, 5:38 am

37 HWT (182cm-6' / 80kg-176lb) Should I be able to row a 1:49.0 2k?

Easily. Will depend on technique though. What rating (stroke per minute) did you use in the intervals?

Suggest you train at 200W and rate 20 for a while.

I think the question was asked in relation to his current condition, not in relation of his stats.
Based on his stats he could also row a 1:40 2k or faster, but that needs training. If you didn't train accordingly it will not happen.
Of course you are right, but answer points not directly to the question.

rOw wrote: ↑

January 28th, 2023, 4:26 pm

Hello rowers,

Today I did a 6x500m with 2' rest.
My pace target was 1:49, a pace that would improve my 2k PB (I plan a TT in the next month or so).

My splits :
1:49.2
1:48.9
1:49.0
1:48.9
1:49.0
1:48.9

Spot on, and at the end I felt that I could still have done some hundreds of meters more, maybe a full 7th interval, at the same pace.

So my question is : does this kind of session can be used as a 2k predictor?
Should I be able to row a 1:49.0 2k?

I'm primarily a runner and some training sessions can be used as 5k/10k time predictors.

Thanks!

If you use 1min recovery you won't be far away.

The best predictor for a 2k is a 2k.

Thanks for all the feedbacks!

Nomath wrote:It would be more useful if you had added the HR's at the end of each split.

It was 160 / 163 / 164 / 166 / 167 / 168 . My running maxHR is 190 but I don’t know (or at least, don’t remember) my rowing maxHR.

MPx wrote:I believe a 6x500 2r piece can be done at around 2k -2or3 pace.

You mean, about 1:46-1:47 for each 500m ?

Tony Cook wrote:8 x 500 at 5min starts and 4 x 1k at 10 min starts can be done at 2k pace.

A 5mn start for the 500m = 3’10’’ of rest. With this rest I think I would have completed 8 reps @1:49. Maybe I’ll target a 8x500m next time.

Sakly wrote:Your current PB is already a 1:50 split, so 1:49 is very near.

My 2k PB was in February of 2019 so a looong time ago and I’ve not attempted any 2k TT since. So not sure I've came back to the same level.

Dangerscouse wrote:Persinally, I'd recommend doing 750m+, and ideally 1k+ as the mental battle is far better challenged in these sessions.

Like 3x1000m ? Or 4x750m ?

jamesg wrote:What rating (stroke per minute) did you use in the intervals?
Suggest you train at 200W and rate 20 for a while.

Between 30 (most of the time) and 32 s/m.
I never look at watts so don’t know what it means compared to my sessions. A typical steady session for me is between 2:10-2:14 splits @20-22 s/m. For 30 to 40mn.

Sakly wrote:I think the question was asked in relation to his current condition, not in relation of his stats.

All the PBs in my signature have been made since September 2022, except from the 2k in 2019.
These are pretty in line with my running PBs, so I really don’t expect to pull a 1:40 one day
But I can still improve my technique and specific conditioning.

nick rockliff wrote:The best predictor for a 2k is a 2k.

Definitely, but I would be disappointed to destroy myself on a TT without improving my time. So I try to evaluate my chances first

rOw wrote: ↑

January 29th, 2023, 8:55 am

Sakly wrote:I think the question was asked in relation to his current condition, not in relation of his stats.

All the PBs in my signature have been made since September 2022, except from the 2k in 2019.
These are pretty in line with my running PBs, so I really don’t expect to pull a 1:40 one day
But I can still improve my technique and specific conditioning.

Running is not rowing, don't compare it.
My first 1k PB of January 2022 was 3:24.x so very near to yours.
My first 2k PB was 6:58.x, ca. 6 month after training I pulled a 6:46.x and think I can go for ~6:43 on a good day. 1:40 not far away.
You are heavier and taller than me, so from your body stats you are theoretically capable of even faster times when training properly.

rOw wrote: ↑

January 29th, 2023, 8:55 am

Like 3x1000m ? Or 4x750m ?

4 x 1k five mins rest is always thought of as a great predictor, and I'd be aiming for 5 x 750m if you'd prefer that. You need to exceed the distance if you're having rests.

rOw wrote: ↑

January 29th, 2023, 8:55 am

MPx wrote:I believe a 6x500 2r piece can be done at around 2k -2or3 pace.

You mean, about 1:46-1:47 for each 500m ?

Yes, that's it. If you can do the 6x500 2r in 1:46/7 you should be on for 2k at 1:49.

Nevertheless, I do agree with others here that the 4x1k 5r is a better indicator (either as the pace or +1 so in your case 4x1 @1:50 suggests 1:49 poss for 2k.

I did my 2K PB two days ago and tried 8x (500m + 3min rest) today.
Result: 2K PB avg pace = 1:51.6, 8x500m avg pace = 1:49.6.

Spot on what MPx said (2K = 8x500 + 2s).

For what is worth, I felt I could have gone a bit faster in my 8x500m.

And today I tried a 4x 1000m with 5min rest and well, that was a totally different game.
In the same week I've done:

• My 2K PB, at 1:51.7 avg pace
• The 8x 500m with 3min rest, at 1:49.6 average (faster/slower 500m pace = 1:48.9 / 1:50.5). So 2s better that my 2K PB and I could probably have gone faster.
• The 4x 1000m with 5min rest, at 1:52.8 avg pace (faster/slower 500m pace = 1:49.3 / 1:54.6, ouch). So 1s worse than my 2K PB and it was a real pain (except the 1st 1000m).

Maybe it was just a bad day, or maybe it's just me, but I found the 4x1000m+5r way harder than the 8x 500m+3r.