Concept2 Forum

Hi I'm a 16 year old 5'9" J18 rower, and I weigh 83kgs, I've been rowing for about 12-13 months now and I row a PB 2k of 8.07.2 (july 2013) and the last 2k test I did my time was 8.13.2 (October 10th 2013). I need to have my 2k around the 7.50 mark in about 35 days and I need help doing this. I need to know what to eat when to eat, what erg to do etc. I train 8 times a week but I feel like I'm going nowhere.

I'd also like to lose a few kilos and be around 73-5kgs, but I don't know how to diet but still have energy to train 6 days a week… but thats more of a long term goal, the 2k goal is more urgent.
I have a coach, but he pays more attention to the club's golden J18 girl than to me so I'm kind of on my own

My train plan are:
Monday: 5x2000m
Tuesday: water or 5k run and weights
Wednesday: water or 5x2000 or 4x10mins
Thursday: water or 3k run weight and circuits
Saturday: 4x1800 m steady state on the water (sculling) 30 minute break then erg session
Sunday: 4x1800 m SS, 30 minute break, weights session

Advice greatly appreciated, thank you

If your technique is not good, then that is probably where you should focus your attention in order to get the quickest results. With proper technique you will make your strokes more powerful without changing the amount of effort you put into each stroke.

Watch the following videos: http://www.concept2.com/indoor-rowers/t ... que-videos and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqVmMd7FdAA.

The following tips helped me increase my power application: back stays tall and braced throughout the entire stroke; at the catch, tuck your butt further up the railing to maximize the amount of leg power going into the stroke; keep your shoulders down and relaxed ("out of your ears") throughout the stroke; the drive phase must be quick and powerful, while the recovery is slower.

If technique isn't the issue, then a combination of 6ks and 8x500, 1' rest, workouts over the next 35 days should help you.

Are you getting enough rest between each day that you work out? How much sleep are you getting? Rest and sleep are important in order to maximize the quality of your workouts.

eat less processed food, sugar, soda,etc... think whole grains, vegetables, lean protiens
get plenty of sleep, this is very important
and continue to work hard
I would throw some 500s in there and not just do all long repeats

Novicegirl -

It is my opinion that every workout you do should have a point. It should work your aerobic system, or your lactate threshold, or your VO2 max, or your strength, etc. It strikes me from your workouts that some of them don't necessarily target any of these very well. In other words, they sound like junk miles to me. (I know it's meters, just go with it)

For example - doing 4 x 2k seems like too much to properly target lactate threshold, and definitely too little to be aerobic. It's just a no mans land workout. Instead do 2 x 2k or 3 x 2k, at a high enough intensity that it's actually working that lactate clearance, but slow enough that you can maintain the same pace on all three without flying and dying.

Same goes for 5 x 2k, which I don't see what it could possibly be targeting.

I think you are doing a lot of workouts, but the reason your times aren't dropping is that the workouts aren't targeting a specific physiological system.

I'd like to hear more about your splits/rests/etc on each workout

I fully agree with what ArmandoChavez posted, it's the same thing I thought (although phrased better than I would have managed).

Additional thoughts, which are mostly my personal opinion:
1) Do an hour-long session each week (aerobic capacity). Based on your Oct 10 2k, I suggest trying to hold an average power of 145 watts. Overall this will be easiest if you put out constant power instead of trying to do bursts of power. Hydrate well ahead of time so that you can finish without taking a break. Since you're not doing long sessions, know ahead of time that this will probably be miserable, and hurt just as much as your 2k, except for longer. If you're not used to longer distances, you will probably fail the first time--that's ok, failure is success in progress, just try again next week. If you make it, bump the power up next time; for your target 2K time you'll want to work up to about 166W. Map out a schedule between now and then to plan your increases evenly. In my opinion long suffering pieces are the key to having the mental fortitude to keep the hammer down when things get painful. When you can suffer through the last 15 minutes of an hour-long piece, those last 800 meters of the 2k feel like a freebie.
2) Do a sprint session each week. They train your body to go harder and faster (anaerobic capacity and neuromuscular power). Other people have mentioned 500's and I agree. sharp_rower called out 8x500, which I presume would be done at roughly 2k pacing. My suggestion instead would be to do intervals of 500s at 500 pacing. Warm up well, then do the first interval at a good natural 500 pace without going light on yourself. Rest a few minutes, try to match it. Rest a few minutes, try to match it again, etc. Instead of a set limit on the number of intervals, make it performance based--e.x. when you pull a 500 that's 10 seconds slower than the first, time to call it off.
3) Do a 2K each week (VO2Max). As in warmup, 2K at a targeted pace, cooldown, off the erg. I don't think going into a 2K test should have any amount of surprise to it. You should know about what you can do and know about how much pain to expect.
4) For any other erg sessions in the week, do a 30 minute row (lactate threshold). Same steady state drill as the hour-long, suggested starting power of 158W, try to progress up to 181W.

This is basically the outline of workouts I did earlier this year. In four weeks I took my 2K from 253W to 280W. You're trying to go from 187 to 216, which is a bigger percentage increase, but I also did an additional 210K of junk meters on the erg and 400 bike miles with 29,000 feet of vertical, and lost 8 pounds in the process, while working a full time job. I was intentionally and massively overextending my recovery ability, which was good for the weight loss but bad for performance. If you can do this sort of training schedule without all of the stupid extra crap I did, I don't see why you shouldn't be able to pull off the time you want.

This schedule IS hard if you do it right. It might be harder than your current schedule. If your recovery starts to get overly taxed, and you start to feel drained, prioritize the erg. Lose weight training sessions first, then running. If you get that far and still don't feel you have enough energy, subtract one erg session, then reduce OTW distance/intensity and use it solely to focus on technique. If you still have problems, eat and sleep more, sacrificing social/entertainment time or risking an extra kilogram if you have to. Remember that it's a short term push.

If instead you don't have energy issues, awesome! Push yourself harder with all-out sprint finishes and enjoy watching your numbers improve.

You're doing far too much work.

Cut out all the weights and do the last 5 weeks of an Interactive 2k schedule taken from here, considering the work afloat as part of the program, not on top of it:

http://therowingcompany.com/training/interactive

Even if you don't like this idea, it's essential to do practically nothing in the last week, as the program says.

I do have good technique. My 2k "strategy" is to have a hard start but not too hard.... around 1.50-55 for the first 100m then I settle to 2.04-2.06/500m then I sprint at the last 250 (usually at 1.50-1.58/500m ) the last 2k I did our coach had us do it at rate 24 for the first 3/4 then whatever we want for the last 1/4.

I'm not an expert, coach or elite athete.
I don't understand how your coach wants you to personal best? Your 2k time @ a 24 spm rating?

I only rowed in college (men's club team). On the water your starting rate might hit 42-44 spm and settle to a 32-38spm depending on your team and course conditions.

On a stationary erg I used to settle into the body of a 2k around 28spm but if I recall my personal best erg piece rated at 30-32.

I'd be way of my personal best if I rated that low during a 2k.

Novicegirl123 wrote:I do have good technique. My 2k "strategy" is to have a hard start but not too hard.... around 1.50-55 for the first 100m then I settle to 2.04-2.06/500m then I sprint at the last 250 (usually at 1.50-1.58/500m ) the last 2k I did our coach had us do it at rate 24 for the first 3/4 then whatever we want for the last 1/4.

There's a pretty big difference between 1:50 and 1:55, and also between 1:50 and 1:58. You need a more targeted strategy to get the result you want. Figure out splits for each 500 that add up to your desired time, and go from there.

novicegirl - just out of curiosity, where are you rowing at?

If you have a choice to adjust your erg workouts, I really suggest you do. If they are the workouts your coach is giving you, then it becomes a bit tougher.

Yeah, these are the workouts that our coach gives to us. The other girls seem to not mind (we all find them painful haha, but I'm the only one that sees little benefit from doing them). I can't really contest my coach, he's nice enough but he think he knows what's best.

I know that eating habits can have a big effect in performance, I'm not really a nutrition buff, so could anyone start pointing me in the right direction?

I get up at about 6.30 (I go to be latest 11 pm, usually 10.30)
I rarely have breakfast, and if undo its either a small yoghurt of a banana
Mid morning I'd have some fruit, some days I'd have like something bad like a brownie or something
Lunch I'd have leftovers from last night or a sandwich (chicken white bread cheese mayonnaise lettuce usually)
Pre-taining I might have pasta if I have time (5 pm, training is at 6.30)
Post training (9 pm approximately) I'd have my dinner which is usually pasta of rice (always a very carb heavy meal)
Then finish up homework and bedtime.

I row in Ireland by the way

My 2 cts. I would do 2 times a week interval session with 4-6x500 mtr @ 1:55 with rest rest 1 min. Every week cut down the rest with 15 sec. In addition 2 days with 2-3x 2.000mtr @2:00-2:02 and one session 5.000mtr at any tempo you would like at that moment. Total 5 days per week. 2 Days rest which you will need as rest is making the adaptions of fitness.

As for racing strategy I personally belief in first 1.000 mtrs agressive but steady followed by 500 mtr 1 or 2 seconds faster than first 1.000 mtr and final 500 mtr all out (ie negative split between first and second 1.000 mtr).

Novicegirl, You're an athlete eat like one. Try a fruit smoothie with added protein powder for breakfast or post workout meal. You've gotta feed your engine. I'm not coach and have only been erging as long as you have but I know what works for me. All my training has been for a HM. I am now ready to try the 2k thing. I row three times a week.
Day 1 2k for time. Recover then MAX effort intervals 20 sec on / 20 sec off. Always trying to increase watts.
Day 2 500m on 1 min rest at projected race pace for 8 sets. Then next workout increase distance to 600m then 700. Because of your short time frame try a pyramid of 500, 750 and 1000 at race pace. Recover and repeat.
Day 3 30min - 60 min row.
This has worked for me. I keep lowering my 2k time and a surprise is that my 5k has dropped even more.
Keep us updated as to your progress.

So Novicegirl123: it's been 35 days, how did you do??