Concept2 Forum

I had a huge discussion with some of my fellow rowers couple days back, about how many rowers in the world can make sub 6min on a 2k? So then we are talking about active rowers, and not inclusive runners, NFL, NBA and so on.

So how many rowers in the world can go sub 6min on a 2k?

Answers with sources or reasons behind estimations are appreciated

Thetanium wrote:I had a huge discussion with some of my fellow rowers couple days back, about how many rowers in the world can make sub 6min on a 2k? So then we are talking about active rowers, and not inclusive runners, NFL, NBA and so on.

So how many rowers in the world can go sub 6min on a 2k?

Answers with sources or reasons behind estimations are appreciated

If you take a look at national erg championships over the world sub 6 ergs are not very rare. Plus not al rowers erg seriously. But I don,t dare to name a number.....

BTW without preperation I don,t see many, if any , other athletes go sub 6 without specific training. Most endurance athletes are not big enough. The best changes maybe for tall swimmers ? and canoeers.

Total guesstimate: 300-400, depending on things like whether it's an Olympic year and when in the training year the result might be achieved.

Somewhere I have the April 1999 US national men's 2k test results. By my count no fewer than 40 men went sub-6 on the last or the next-to-last trial. Figure another 10-20 sub-6-achieving rowers who didn't choose to participate in the trials (injured; headed to grad school; illness; marriage; taking up post-university jobs; just aren't interested in a national-team time commitment). That's 50-60 sub-6 rowers right there. Offhand I'd guess Germany could put together 30 in a similar pre-Olympic test. GB, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Romania, France, the Netherlands, Italy, Croatia, Russia, etc. are all going to have maybe 20. And even smaller rowing countries like Norway and Estonia and Belgium are going to have sub-6 rowers.

Then too you have to factor in under-23s who have broken 6:00 but aren't testing with their country's senior men. And non-OTW rowers like Gareth Archer (GB, former rugby player), Nik Fleming (GB, erger), Anton Grassl (Germany, canoist), Graham Benton (GB, started out erg only), etc. who break 6:00 on an erg outside the water-rowing establishment.

NavigationHazard wrote:Total guesstimate: 300-400, depending on things like whether it's an Olympic year and when in the training year the result might be achieved.

Somewhere I have the April 1999 US national men's 2k test results. By my count no fewer than 40 men went sub-6 on the last or the next-to-last trial. Figure another 10-20 sub-6-achieving rowers who didn't choose to participate in the trials (injured; headed to grad school; illness; marriage; taking up post-university jobs; just aren't interested in a national-team time commitment). That's 50-60 sub-6 rowers right there. Offhand I'd guess Germany could put together 30 in a similar pre-Olympic test. GB, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Romania, France, the Netherlands, Italy, Croatia, Russia, etc. are all going to have maybe 20. And even smaller rowing countries like Norway and Estonia and Belgium are going to have sub-6 rowers.

Then too you have to factor in under-23s who have broken 6:00 but aren't testing with their country's senior men. And non-OTW rowers like Gareth Archer (GB, former rugby player), Nik Fleming (GB, erger), Anton Grassl (Germany, canoist), Graham Benton (GB, started out erg only), etc. who break 6:00 on an erg outside the water-rowing establishment.

Thanks for a good answer, I know there is about 20 in the Netherlands and 3-4 in Norway. But this gave me a good impression of how many athletes can do it, I had no knowledge of USA´s records so that was good to know.
But I dont think this is much of 300-400, I said under 1000 ppl, which was pretty vague.

When you mentioned NBA in the original post it made me wonder what a guy like Lebron James could do for 2k if he trained with a purpose. 6'8", 270 lbs, fast, powerful, coordinated. Pretty damn fast I'd guess.

If you put LeBron James on an erg right now, quickly showed him the basics of erging, and let him do a 2k, I doubt he would go faster than 6:45 or so, which weight adjusted wouldn't be that good whatsoever.

Even if he did go faster for his weight he'd have to pull a 5:40 or so to be any good.

ArmandoChavezUNC wrote:If you put LeBron James on an erg right now, quickly showed him the basics of erging, and let him do a 2k, I doubt he would go faster than 6:45 or so, which weight adjusted wouldn't be that good whatsoever.

Even if he did go faster for his weight he'd have to pull a 5:40 or so to be any good.

To be honest I would be very surprised if Lebron were that slow. While basketball isn't exactly an endurance sport, you do have to be pretty fit to run a game for 50 minutes. I think that rugby is somewhat similar aerobically to basketball, and many former rugby players have become outstanding indoor rowers. Garath Archer won British Indoor Rowing Championships, and Andy Ripley holds the world heavyweight record for 50-54. Also, Lebron is just frickin enormous (wich I realize would be detrimental OTW). I would put my money on Lebron getting under 6:20 with little training, and under 6:00 with a year or so of training. It's too bad that Lebron probably won't actually do this.

SwimmerTurnedRower wrote:

ArmandoChavezUNC wrote:I would put my money on Lebron getting under 6:20 with little training, and under 6:00 with a year or so of training. It's too bad that Lebron probably won't actually do this.

I disagree.

I think Lebron *could* get under 6:20 with training (not "little" training, though), but I think it's a *great* thing that he dosen't row. He's a 1 in a billion kind of talent with basketball. I don't think he'd be a 1 in a billion talent with rowing. The man is doing exactly what he was born to do.

ArmandoChavezUNC wrote:If you put LeBron James on an erg right now, quickly showed him the basics of erging, and let him do a 2k, I doubt he would go faster than 6:45 or so, which weight adjusted wouldn't be that good whatsoever.

Even if he did go faster for his weight he'd have to pull a 5:40 or so to be any good.

I was 193, 90 kg the first time I did a 2k test, with minimal preperation. And I did 6.46.7.
So there is no way that a top athlete of 110 kg 203 couldnt do more than 6:45, being trained in both aerobic and anarobic capacity.
And then you got Shaquille O'Neal 147 kg 216cm, I would be very surprised if didnt make 6 flat.
Although this isnt weight adjusted, but that wasnt the questions in the firstplace.

Thetanium wrote:

ArmandoChavezUNC wrote:If you put LeBron James on an erg right now, quickly showed him the basics of erging, and let him do a 2k, I doubt he would go faster than 6:45 or so, which weight adjusted wouldn't be that good whatsoever.

Even if he did go faster for his weight he'd have to pull a 5:40 or so to be any good.

I was 193, 90 kg the first time I did a 2k test, with minimal preperation. And I did 6.46.7.
So there is no way that a top athlete of 110 kg 203 couldnt do more than 6:45, being trained in both aerobic and anarobic capacity.
And then you got Shaquille O'Neal 147 kg 216cm, I would be very surprised if didnt make 6 flat.
Although this isnt weight adjusted, but that wasnt the questions in the firstplace.

6.46 = 333 Watt
5.46 = 522 Watt So 56 % more.

Some like Shaquille has a very poor aerobic base, sure he has power, but even that is relative to his body not great. really big guys don,t pull a very good time on an erg.
They proberly pull a strong 500 meter, but a 2k is to far. The athletic guys who can jump and run the hole game will do a lot better.

I think there's a lot more prospective sub 6s out there than we give credit for - we're not beautiful and unique snowflakes just because we row.

I'm pretty sure Tim Brabants went under 6 when he did a 2k - kayakers do a shedload of aerobic training, as well as strength work - usually tiny little legs though.
I'd also back quite a few heavyweight boxers to do it. I used to train with some elite amateurs a few years ago, and they picked up the movement quickly, were hideously fit, and just nails.
Swimmers - quite possibly, though it would take a good deal of strength work. They have great pain tolerance, good work ethic, and pretty much all you need.

But people who can actually do it, there's not so many...

ausrwr wrote:I think there's a lot more prospective sub 6s out there than we give credit for - we're not beautiful and unique snowflakes just because we row.

I'm pretty sure Tim Brabants went under 6 when he did a 2k - kayakers do a shedload of aerobic training, as well as strength work - usually tiny little legs though.
I'd also back quite a few heavyweight boxers to do it. I used to train with some elite amateurs a few years ago, and they picked up the movement quickly, were hideously fit, and just nails.
Swimmers - quite possibly, though it would take a good deal of strength work. They have great pain tolerance, good work ethic, and pretty much all you need.

But people who can actually do it, there's not so many...

Sure 6.00 is not that speciale compared to the Wr, so yes there must be loads of people who can if they trained a bit, but you have to big and fit, It's not for nothing that only one lightweight ever pulled a sub 6 erg.

I bet Nordic Skiers could post some really good times, especially for lightweights. Skiers generally aren't as big as rowers, but they have giant aerobic engines (highest recorded VO2max is Bjorn Daehlie; a skier) and it's an aerobic activity that requires arms and legs. When I was in high school the regions best skier joined the team for a semester. His first time ever sitting down on an erg he pulled a 6:59, that's just based off of ski training. He was around 5'9 and 160lbs. It was a shame he didn't stick with it. I'd love to see some of the skiers that train mostly for sprints hop on an erg.

I think you could add a few of the MMA fighters to the list of prospective fast ergers. These guys train very specifically to go balls-out for 5 minutes. George St. Pierre would be a lightweight erger and could be a beast with dedicated erg training.

ThatMoos3Guy wrote:I bet Nordic Skiers could post some really good times, especially for lightweights. Skiers generally aren't as big as rowers, but they have giant aerobic engines (highest recorded VO2max is Bjorn Daehlie; a skier) and it's an aerobic activity that requires arms and legs. When I was in high school the regions best skier joined the team for a semester. His first time ever sitting down on an erg he pulled a 6:59, that's just based off of ski training. He was around 5'9 and 160lbs. It was a shame he didn't stick with it. I'd love to see some of the skiers that train mostly for sprints hop on an erg.

I bet they could also set a WR for 6k/10k...