Ranger's training thread

Tinpusher · Post by **Tinpusher** » February 9th, 2011, 8:17 pm

Quite a busy start to the day on this thread:

Postby ranger » February 8th, 2011, 11:10 pm
Postby ranger » February 8th, 2011, 11:28 pm
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 1:02 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 1:05 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 1:17 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 2:50 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 3:04 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 3:07 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 3:15 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 3:40 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:10 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:15 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:32 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:37 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:46 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 7:43 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 9:06 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 9:10 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 9:38 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 10:20 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 1:51 pm

When does he eat, sleep, do any gainful work, take a $hit, let alone do all those hours of erging (without breaks) and endless hours of weight maintenance cross training? Surely you could find the time to squeeze in a screenshot or two, no?

mikvan52 · Post by **mikvan52** » February 9th, 2011, 8:51 pm

Anyone remember this gem?

ranger : November 23rd, 2010, 9:03 am wrote:I'll enter the distance "pieces" that I do in the 50s heavyweight rankings until Jan. 25, 2011, and then in the 60s heavyweight rankings after that.

Ranking check : today : ranger entries = zilch
wha' happened?
Did "juice lady" tie him up an hold him hostage?

MRapp · Post by **MRapp** » February 9th, 2011, 9:52 pm

Tinpusher wrote:Quite a busy start to the day on this thread:

Postby ranger » February 8th, 2011, 11:10 pm
Postby ranger » February 8th, 2011, 11:28 pm
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 1:02 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 1:05 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 1:17 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 2:50 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 3:04 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 3:07 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 3:15 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 3:40 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:10 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:15 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:32 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:37 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 6:46 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 7:43 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 9:06 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 9:10 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 9:38 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 10:20 am
Postby ranger » February 9th, 2011, 1:51 pm

When does he eat, sleep, do any gainful work, take a $hit, let alone do all those hours of erging (without breaks) and endless hours of weight maintenance cross training? Surely you could find the time to squeeze in a screenshot or two, no?

In the words of the great poet Jim Carrey..."Wow, what a pathetic loser!" I thought I was a loser for looking at this thread so often. Thanks ranger, I feel better now.

TomR · Post by **TomR** » February 9th, 2011, 10:44 pm

a JoanVB sighting?

I skimmed a couple of earlier pages, but missed it. Congrats, girl, on your Long Beach result. You're predictable, which is a compliment.

And compliments, too, to John Bove, whoever he is. His is the most unequivocal and eloquent contempt. There's a hot purity in his unwillingness to be amused by this effluvia.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » February 9th, 2011, 10:52 pm

Re: Ranger's training thread
by Joanvb » February 3rd, 2011, 6:23 pm

Good luck, goblin. Sounds like a solid plan.Joan Van Blom
58 Ltwt.
Long Beach Rowing Association

It's on Page 620 which is only a few days back but many pages ago since ranger is setting new records in number of posts per day. It's good to see he's in fine form setting records in something.

Bob S. · Post by **Bob S.** » February 10th, 2011, 12:02 am

Gus wrote:
Gus wrote:Careful. Moderator running amuck!

After reading a couple of your diatribes, I figure that you are the one who is running amuck.

Bob S.

Gus · Post by **Gus** » February 10th, 2011, 12:20 am

Bob S. wrote:
Gus wrote:
Gus wrote:Careful. Moderator running amuck!
After reading a couple of your diatribes, I figure that you are the one who is running amuck.

Bob S.

Ah sometimes the way we think quoting works isn't always the way it turns out.

The part of what was quoted:

"You must be new here or have a much higher boredom threshold. Ranger could be a good erger but his narcisstic personality disorder spoils everything. He's unpleasant, he won't stand on the podium and accept his medal, he won't pay his debt, he won't listen to folks who try to offer suggestions on how to improve - therefore he deserves to be ignored.

His trolling on this forum does nothing. His advice to other rowers is worthless. As Al says, "He's a complete waste of oxygen".

was not written by me. It was written by Citroen. If you're concerned with that being bitter and/or abusive you should let him know. I'm not a moderator here and can't control what others post. I moderated other forums.

Bob S. · Post by **Bob S.** » February 10th, 2011, 1:02 am

Gus wrote:
Bob S. wrote:
Gus wrote:Careful. Moderator running amuck!
After reading a couple of your diatribes, I figure that you are the one who is running amuck.

Bob S.
Ah sometimes the way we think quoting works isn't always the way it turns out.

The part of what was quoted:

"You must be new here or have a much higher boredom threshold. Ranger could be a good erger but his narcisstic personality disorder spoils everything. He's unpleasant, he won't stand on the podium and accept his medal, he won't pay his debt, he won't listen to folks who try to offer suggestions on how to improve - therefore he deserves to be ignored.

His trolling on this forum does nothing. His advice to other rowers is worthless. As Al says, "He's a complete waste of oxygen".

was not written by me. It was written by Citroen. If you're concerned with that being bitter and/or abusive you should let him know. I'm not a moderator here and can't control what others post. I moderated other forums.

I wasn't quoting Citroen, I was quoting you and, as far as I can see, the only quoting error was that it was a double quote, both with your name and just the two very short sentences - a total of 4 words.. The diatribes to which I referred are a couple of long paragraphs by you later in that message and some of your comments about Citroen in previous messages.

I have Ranger on the block list, so I don't see his messages except for quotes in the replies. Since yours seem to be getting as tiresome as his, it looks like should add one more name to the list.

Bob S.

luckylindy · Post by **luckylindy** » February 10th, 2011, 1:19 am

Bob S. wrote: I have Ranger on the block list, so I don't see his messages except for quotes in the replies. Since yours seem to be getting as tiresome as his, it looks like should add one more name to the list.

Bob S.

Can't we all just get along?
**said as I duck out of this thread for a while**

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 10th, 2011, 4:33 am

If you are a veteran erger, there is no reason to row badly (e.g., 9 SPI for lightweights, 12 SPI for heavyweights).

To row well, you just need to learn how to row with effective and efficient length, sequencing, timing, leverage, posture, rhythmicity, quickness, balance, footwork, relaxation, smoothness, resistance, etc.

The ability to row well doesn't necessarily decline with age, as people like Dick Cashin demonstrate, if you just learn to row well and then do all of your training rowing well.

Rowing well is 13 SPI for lightweights; 16 SPI for heavyweights.

You row badly if never learn to row well and/or know how to row well but never do it in your training and racing.

The major myth is that the only way to get a high stroking power is pulling harder, i.e., using much more effort, much more skeletal-muscular strain and aerobic cost, per stroke.

Naw.

That's not it at all.

To row well, you just need to learn how to have effective and efficient length, sequencing, timing, leverage, posture, rhythmicity, quickness, balance, footwork, relaxation, smoothness, resistance, etc.

It doesn't take any more skeletal-motor strain and aerobic cost to row well than it does to row poorly.

When you row well, you just make maximally effective and efficient use of your skeletal-motor and aerobic resources.

Even though I am 60 years old, I now row well (13 SPI) at low drag (119 df.).

So I just go along 1:43 @ 25 spm (12.8 SPI) with a middlin' UT1 heartrate.

A decade ago, when I rowed poorly (10 SPI) at max drag (200+ df.), I pulled 1:52 @ 25 spm (10 SPI), 11 seconds per 500m slower, even though I was a decade younger.

Back then, I pulled 250 watts when I was rating 26 spm; I now pull 320 watts when I am rating 26 spm.

The difference is 70 watts, but the level of effort, the skeletal-muscular and aerobic cost, is about the same.

Middlin' UT1, physiologically, with entirely comfortable skeletal-muscular effort.

When you row poorly at high drag, you not only lower your pace at some rate, your lower your ratio.

Because of (1) the high drag and (2) your poor mechanics, the chain is doubly slow.

So, in each stroke cycle, you work longer and rest less.

Rowing with 30% more stroking power at half the drag, I now row 26 spm in close to twice the ratio I used a decade ago when I rowed poorly at max drag.

3.5-to-1 rather than 2-to-1.

That's an _enormous_ increase in efficiency.

ranger

PaulH · Post by **PaulH** » February 10th, 2011, 4:34 am

ranger wrote: Rowing well is 13 SPI for lightweights; 16 SPI for heavyweights.

There is no evidence for this statement.

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 10th, 2011, 5:03 am

Andy Ripley pulled 16 SPI.

Dick Cashin pulls 15.5 SPI.

Nik Fleming pulls 15.5 SPI.

In their prime, the great Danish lightweights (Stephansen, Ebbesen, etc.) pull 12 SPI.

The great Italian lightweights (Elia Luini, etc.) pull 13 SPI.

When he set the 40s lwt WR, Mike Caviston pulled 12.5 SPI.

13/16 SPI @ 37 spm gives you the Open lightweight and heavyweight WRs.

When I pulled sub-6:30 at 55, without even preparing for it, I pulled 12 SPI; I now pull 13 SPI.

Graham Benton pulls 17 SPI.

Etc.

ranger

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 10th, 2011, 5:37 am

So, clearly, for the best ergers, it is rate that varies with age and aerobic capacity, not stroking power.

Stroking power, rowing well vs. rowing poorly, doesn't (necessarily) decline with age.

It is a constant.

If you are a talented erger, there is no reason to row poorly, no matter what your age.

You just need to spend some time learning to row well.

Then you just need to row well in all of your training and racing.

If you spend the time and effort to learn how to do it (and then do it in all of your training and racing), you'll always go faster at all distances if you row well rather than poorly.

ranger

PaulH · Post by **PaulH** » February 10th, 2011, 5:43 am

PaulH wrote:
ranger wrote: Rowing well is 13 SPI for lightweights; 16 SPI for heavyweights.
There is no evidence for this statement.

I repeat, there is no evidence for your statement.

ranger · Post by **ranger** » February 10th, 2011, 5:45 am

To row 6:18 when he was 55, Dick Cashin didn't trade rate for pace, pulling only 10.5 SPI but pumping the rate up to 38 spm.

He pulled 15.5 SPI and rated 27 spm.

ranger