Pondering the Beginner Pete Plan

[Rowan McSheen]

I tend to breathe in on the drive and then out on the return and I've found the breathing in to go better since working to reduce overstretch at the catch, maybe it puts me in a better posture to fill the lungs. It's easy when running - in for so many steps and out for so many. I think that when rating up I breathe in and out on each drive and then try to take in some more air on the recovery but that probably amounts to panting. It is indeed not intuitive!

Anyhoo, first 6000m of week 3 done, to hr at UT1 level. At 2:17.6 pace was 1.5 sec/500 lower than last week's 5500 due to hr drift. I expect the overall pace to continue to decline as we go through summer and then improve when the cooler season returns.

[Sakly]

On drive I always breathe out, based on stroke power more or less hard. This is something which is absolutely automatic as in strength training you can create most force and stability with this approach. Same applies for rowing and any other hard power movement.
On steady state slow rows I typically only breathe once, so inhale at recovery phase. On harder slow rate (<=20) rows I breathe twice times, on faster ones a bit dynamically changing, but on drive phase never inhaling.

[aegis]

I use the beginner pete plan as a base and do the two weekly steady states for an hour, I do follow the intervals and may do a third SS each week.
At the moment I'm on week 6 and just did the 3*2km today, what is surprising is that I'm spending more time than I expected in my zone 5 (I use Karnoven formula) compared to the last two weeks intervals. I guess it is doing its job and allowing one to endure a little longer.

I'm curious as to how much improvement do folks see if they complete the full 24 weeks? I'm targeting a 7:30 2k and am wondering if it will take me years to reach 7min? Currently at 3 days SS, 1 day intervals, 1 day with kettlebells/rings at home.

[Dangerscouse]

I'm curious as to how much improvement do folks see if they complete the full 24 weeks? I'm targeting a 7:30 2k and am wondering if it will take me years to reach 7min? Currently at 3 days SS, 1 day intervals, 1 day with kettlebells/rings at home.

There are too many variables to give a reliable answer as it's affected by far too many things, but if you keep working hard and following the plan it shouldn't take years to reach seven minutes.

It is worth noting there's no guarantee that you will reach seven minutes, no matter how hard you try, as everyone has their own limit. Don't be put off trying to reach it though, as the only way you'll know for certain is giving it everything.

[aegis]

Thanks for chiming in, I'm trying to put in the work now for a good aerobic base and think I need to work on power as well. I don't lift a lot mostly bodyweight calisthenics.
I can appreciate that it may or may not be attainable just like some of us won't be able to run a sub 3 marathon but always good to have a stretch target I guess.

[Rowan McSheen]

Week 3 session 2 done, 2 x 2000m 4 mins rest. Aimed at midway between 2k and steady row pace, so 2:10. Feels wrong to overrule the mighty Pete's advice to go 2 secs faster than steady pace, but I figure 4 mins rest allows it (2 mins rest would be a different story). Done feeling good, could have managed a third rep but it would have been hard work, so probably about right.

Re breathing: Never really focused on this before but I made an effort to track it today. I seem to be breathing regularly and without much reference to the stroke stage. Sometimes in on the drive, sometimes in on the drive and out on the return. This is likely suboptimal

[Dangerscouse]

Thanks for chiming in, I'm trying to put in the work now for a good aerobic base and think I need to work on power as well. I don't lift a lot mostly bodyweight calisthenics.
I can appreciate that it may or may not be attainable just like some of us won't be able to run a sub 3 marathon but always good to have a stretch target I guess.

Definitely. Don't ever stop trying, and always hope to be able to do it, but don't let it become your definition of success.

[aegis]

Definitely. Don't ever stop trying, and always hope to be able to do it, but don't let it become your definition of success.

Agreed! And I think erging is something I can stick with, about 10months ago I started putting more effort in fitness and starting jumping rope. Started with dying after 15min until I was about to jump thousands of times over an hour.

I'm quite glad I got on the erg to try it out in my office's gym, after a few sessions it was enough for me to buy one used (for a great price!) about 7weeks ago. We'll see where it takes me 6 months and a year from now.

I do have a question about pacing for intervals, is it better to go at a higher stroke rate with less power or lower stroke rate but with more effort? With higher stroke rates for now very quickly I feel the lactate build up in the legs. Also it seems that more power is generated whenever one pushes faster?

[Rowan McSheen]

I do have a question about pacing for intervals, is it better to go at a higher stroke rate with less power or lower stroke rate but with more effort? With higher stroke rates for now very quickly I feel the lactate build up in the legs. Also it seems that more power is generated whenever one pushes faster?

The theory is that you work on the technique of the stroke during steady rows, to increase efficiency and power. Stronger stroke = more power and better performance at all stroke rates, fast and slow. So ideally you would go at higher stroke rates with the same power. And during steady rows you would be pushing as hard as during intervals, at a lower stroke rate but not effort per stroke. If that makes sense.

[Rowan McSheen]

And the second 6000m of BPP week 3 done. Slightly slower than the other one at same hr, which is annoying. I guess pace will continue to drop as the distance lengthens. Wondering which tactic is best, start out a little quicker and bleed the pace as hr drifts or a little slower and aim to hold the pace to hr without drift.

[Dangerscouse]

I do have a question about pacing for intervals, is it better to go at a higher stroke rate with less power or lower stroke rate but with more effort? With higher stroke rates for now very quickly I feel the lactate build up in the legs. Also it seems that more power is generated whenever one pushes faster?

I'm a big advocate of doing a wide variety of most variables. Higher stroke rates will, theoretically at least, allow you to go faster, so they are good to master but they do require a higher degree of fitness, and possibly, as I'm currently trading now, they might be limited by how much oxygen you can utilise and/or deliver to your lungs.

Be careful of going too weak on a higher stroke rate, as this will breed bad habits, as you want it to always be at least a medium-hard hard effort.

[Tsnor]

I do have a question about pacing for intervals, is it better to go at a higher stroke rate with less power or lower stroke rate but with more effort? With higher stroke rates for now very quickly I feel the lactate build up in the legs. Also it seems that more power is generated whenever one pushes faster?

I'm a big advocate of doing a wide variety of most variables. Higher stroke rates will, theoretically at least, allow you to go faster, so they are good to master but they do require a higher degree of fitness, and possibly, as I'm currently trading now, they might be limited by how much oxygen you can utilise and/or deliver to your lungs.

Be careful of going too weak on a higher stroke rate, as this will breed bad habits, as you want it to always be at least a medium-hard hard effort.

If you never do high SPM then you'll have trouble doing it when you want to. Even if lower SPM is better for you try some high SPM work every now and then.

One key to high SPM is getting your hands away fast. At the finish of the stroke your hands are near your chest. Push them out FAST straight and level. Then body over and then legs. The fast hands give you high SPM without changing your recovery slide rate. If you want to go faster then you go up the slide faster, but max the hands first. The first time your try fast slide on recovery you are going to feel it in the back of your legs -- you are pushing muscles you don't normally push at low SPM. Agree with above "wide variety of most variables" is good, so high SPM is good even if it is not fast (for me, any stroke rate above 30 is fast). Enjoy.

[aegis]

Thanks for the tips guys! I was just looking at my data for the intervals and I haven't gone higher than 28spm, I will make an effort to put in a wider range of variables and see how things pan out.
Interestingly, this morning during my zone 2 row I haven't read the replies and I decided to lower the drag factor to about 115 instead of my usual 125 and I was able to get a slightly higher wattage than usual for about 30min before the hr started drifting due to the heat.

[Rowan McSheen]

I do the steady rows at UT1, so once or twice a week I'll do an hour or so at UT2. This morning was 3 x 4000m with short breaks to stretch and take water. Pink Floyd in the headphones and brain in neutral makes for an agreeable way to pass the time.

[Dalos]

I use the beginner pete plan as a base and do the two weekly steady states for an hour, I do follow the intervals and may do a third SS each week.
At the moment I'm on week 6 and just did the 3*2km today, what is surprising is that I'm spending more time than I expected in my zone 5 (I use Karnoven formula) compared to the last two weeks intervals. I guess it is doing its job and allowing one to endure a little longer.

I'm curious as to how much improvement do folks see if they complete the full 24 weeks? I'm targeting a 7:30 2k and am wondering if it will take me years to reach 7min? Currently at 3 days SS, 1 day intervals, 1 day with kettlebells/rings at home.

Cheers for that, I was interested in what ERG zone used and it seems to be the Karnoven zones. (slightly different to the UT2,1,AT,TR,AT I use).

I started at 9:12.7 and with some technique improvements had a 8:38.5 2k. I'd like to be sub 8 and <75kg by the end. Pretty modest by the standard in here, even when I have 20+ years on some of you!

Between work and kids I've been struggling to keep to schedule. Been eating clean though so main gains were on body measurement rather than spit times last few weeks. Week 5 Day 3 (+2 easing in weeks) and I've gone from 27.1% BF to 23.0%, 4.6kgs of pure fat gone. (LBM is basically unchanged, even slightly up if anything). Much better than my first time around when I was losing 50-50 of each. Looking like I might hit the weight goal sooner than expected and with a better %. Can Start working on maintaining and body composition then.