Ranger's training thread

[whp4]

You should be able to, if you have made the improvements you claim, but you cannot.

To your mind, you can't do something until you do it.

Sorry.

Training doesn't work that way.

Everything you achieve in racing some distance in this sport depends on training that both _precedes_ the race and is not itself like the race, but quite a bit different.

So it goes.

Doing 2K trials, over and over, is not at all the way to train yourself to row well for 2K.

ranger

You were talking about a 5k warmup to your workout sessions, and how you should do those faster than you did in 2002-2003, not about racing a 2k. There is nothing stopping you from doing the faster warmup you say you should do except your inability to do it. I pointed out the correlation to the observable we do have, which is your 2k in competition. Everything matches -- despite your protestations to the contrary, you are older and significantly slower. At some point in the future you may pull a rabbit out of your hat and row a faster piece, but you have yet to do so, and you are just guessing at your ability to do so, as you have not demonstrated ANYTHING which gives credence to your predictions. You haven't matched, much less beaten, any of your contemporaneous distance or sharpening pieces from your glory days, so why should we jump along with you to the conclusion that you are much better now? Just because you still have some sweat stains on your basement floor?

[mikvan52]

Why is it that you feel the need to erg before you row in the morning?
Is it to ruin your chances of ever making any progress with a smooth OTW stroke? ... one that might just produce some boat speed?

"Ever"?

"Never"?

I am in no hurry.

I am making lots of progress OTW.

Why do I erg before rowing OTW?

I have a year or so of erging left in order to complete my project of trying to row 6:16 at 60.

Then I will concentrate more OTW.

ranger

So: Let's get things straight.

#1: you have a project of "trying to row" a certain time... over the next "year".... "or so"

then, within the "next year ... or so" you will train to win the Head of the Charles Regatta.

Let me extend my hand to you ! Once again you've chosen another impossible 2-part quest.

A novice rower will win the HOCR (?!)
...based on an erg stroke...
Isn't cyberspace great! More powerful than Psilocybin mushrooms.

When you come down:
Remember...The first thing any serious rower needs to do is to learn how to row. You, yourself, have said that you remain a novice.
Note that I did not say "try to" do.
Don't forget to wipe the dust off your Fluid and keep it in a col place out of the sun. That way it will have more resale value when you discover that the only way you'll break 3:50 for 1k will be car-topping it down the highway.

As for 6:16 on the erg... it is well established that you need 1:24 per 500m speed TODAY in order to do that in the next year... The best you can reasonably hope for is to break Brian Bailey's record... You should be "quite happy with that".. the other 50 60-69 lwt guys in the world will stand up and cheer. AS they say: "Fifty fans can't be wrong!"

(yawn)

[ranger]

You haven't matched, much less beaten, any of your contemporaneous distance or sharpening pieces from your glory days, so why should we jump along with you to the conclusion that you are much better now? Just because you still have some sweat stains on your basement floor?

What _you_ do is relevant to _your_ rowing, but not mine.

So how is it going?

ranger

[ranger]

As for 6:16 on the erg... it is well established that you need 1:24 per 500m speed TODAY in order to do that in the next year...

For sure.

And 1:44 for 10K.

ranger

[rjw]

In erging, your UT training is the major doing, and by and large, with respect to my goal of rowing 6:16 @ 60, that's now done, fait accompli.

I now pull 1:48 @ 25 spm with just over a UT2 heart rate, 150-155 bpm.

Back in 2002-2003, I pulled 1:48 with a heart rate of 172 bpm, top-end UT1.

Does this actually mean anything?

How long can you pull 1:48 @ 25 spm with just over a UT2 heart rate, 150-155 bpm? Just post a screen shot because if you can say that, you must have done it, and measured it - No? Otherwise, what do you base it on?

[whp4]

As for 6:16 on the erg... it is well established that you need 1:24 per 500m speed TODAY in order to do that in the next year...

For sure.

And 1:44 for 10K.

ranger

Sounds like not one, but two reasons you won't be doing a 6:16 2k in this lifetime...

[ranger]

How long can you pull 1:48 @ 25 spm with just over a UT2 heart rate, 150-155 bpm?

2-3 hours?

ranger

[rjw]

How long can you pull 1:48 @ 25 spm with just over a UT2 heart rate, 150-155 bpm?

2-3 hours?

ranger

This would imply that you could row a FM in somewhere around 2:30 +/- right now.

Rich, there is nothing that you have ever done on the erg that would indicate that this is even remotely possible.

Please post a screen shot that contradicts my statement.

Didn't think so!

[whp4]

How long can you pull 1:48 @ 25 spm with just over a UT2 heart rate, 150-155 bpm?

2-3 hours?

ranger

Still haven't figured out how to accurately attribute quotes, eh?

[whp4]

How long can you pull 1:48 @ 25 spm with just over a UT2 heart rate, 150-155 bpm?

2-3 hours?

ranger

This would imply that you could row a FM in somewhere around 2:30 +/- right now.

Rich, there is nothing that you have ever done on the erg that would indicate that this is even remotely possible.

Please post a screen shot that contradicts my statement.

Didn't think so!

Ah, this is ranger we are talking about, the only man in the world immune to cardiac drift over long periods of exertion, yet whose heart doesn't respond quickly enough during an easy UT2 2k. His thought processes show the same apparent resistance to change, too

[ranger]

Rich, there is nothing that you have ever done on the erg that would indicate that this is even remotely possible.

Indeed.

So this is exciting stuff.

I have spent five years learning how to use my legs correctly, but was rowing at an inappropriate drag with a cut slide.

I am now rowing at 123 df. with a full slide.

Much better.

I am doing 1:55 with a heart rate in the 120s!

1:55 is UT2 for a 6:40 2K.

UT2 for me is 145 bpm.

I am pulling 1:48 at 150-155 bpm.

I can row a FM at 155 bpm.

So my efficiency is _way_ up.

Back in 2002-2003, rowing poorly at max drag, I pulled 1:48 with a HR of 172 bpm, right at my anaerobic threshold.

I am now a whole training band better than that.

ranger

[ausrwr]

No you're not.

[ranger]

No you're not.

Yep, I am.

It helps to use your legs when you row.



I pulled a lightweight 6:28 at max drag without using my legs.

Impressive stuff, I guess, but horribly ineffective and inefficient.

These technical difficulties are now gone.

I now row well.

ranger

[PaulH]

I pulled a lightweight 6:28 at max drag without using my legs.

Liar

[rjw]

Rich, there is nothing that you have ever done on the erg that would indicate that this is even remotely possible.

Indeed.

So this is exciting stuff.

I have spent five years learning how to use my legs correctly, but was rowing at an inappropriate drag with a cut slide.

I am now rowing at 123 df. with a full slide.

Much better.

I am doing 1:55 with a heart rate in the 120s!

1:55 is UT2 for a 6:40 2K.

UT2 for me is 145 bpm.

I am pulling 1:48 at 150-155 bpm.

I can row a FM at 155 bpm.

So my efficiency is _way_ up.

Back in 2002-2003, rowing poorly at max drag, I pulled 1:48 with a HR of 172 bpm, right at my anaerobic threshold.

I am now a whole training band better than that.

ranger

Again, this "logic" doesn't indicate the ability to erg a 2:30 +/- marathon. Indeed, a 6:40 2k would suggest a 2:50 +/- marathon. Even a 6:28 suggests mid-2:40's. So again, where is your evidence to suggest that you are capable of a 2:30 +/- marathon?


Actually - you don't have any. No?