Ranger's training thread

[jliddil]

UT1 anything requires endurance

Oh, sure.

But endurance is available to everyone.

All you have to do is work hard and long enough in training.

Endurance has nothing to do with the limitations in physical capacity and skill that determine the quality of erging performances.

Even the worst, most incapable rower, slow as the hills, unskilled, untalented, can have great endurance.

Many _very_ bad rowers can erg all day.

ranger

Once again an outstanding job of demonstrating your complete lack of understanding of exercise physiology. You should get a gold star.

[ranger]

You have admitted you get so tired after 20K of UT1 erging that you are unable to cycle.

Sure.

The body isn't a motor.

It gets tired.

But that's a _very_ different, and much less desperate and limiting, concern from not being able to row some pace, steady state, at low UT1.

If you can't row some pace, steady state, at low UT1, you can't row that pace for a FM.

This limitation doesn't have anything to do with endurance.

The limitation is in physical capacities and technical skills.

ranger

[ranger]

If you are rowing at low UT1, steady state, there is no such thing as a shortfall.

You just row--pretty much as long as you want.

Then you stop.

Sure, you get bored, weary, and generally worn out along the way, and are happy to stop, whenever and wherever that might be, but there is never any _need_ to stop.

You just decide when you don't want to do it any longer.

And that's it.

ranger

As I can, if they are only running a low UT1 HR, steady state, I suspect that lots of people can ride a bike, or step on a stepper, or cross-country ski, or swim, or ..., for just about as long as they want--one hour, two hours, three hours, four hours, five hours. Doesn't matter.

Workin' in the fields.

Diggin' a ditch.

Choppin' trees.

ranger

[ben990]

If you are rowing at low UT1, steady state, there is no such thing as a shortfall.

You just row--pretty much as long as you want.

Then you stop.

Sure, you get bored, weary, and generally worn out along the way, and are happy to stop, whenever and wherever that might be, but there is never any _need_ to stop.

You just decide when you don't want to do it any longer.

And that's it.

ranger

As I can, if they are only running a low UT1 HR, steady state, I suspect that lots of people can ride a bike, or step on a stepper, or cross-country ski, or swim, or ..., for just about as long as they want--one hour, two hours, three hours, four hours, five hours. Doesn't matter.

Workin' in the fields.

Diggin' a ditch.

Choppin' trees.

ranger

And postin' on message boards.

[Byron Drachman]

Let us pretend for sake of argument that Ranger actually does 20K on the erg every day and that he only takes good strokes (13 SPI) as he says he does. Here is an interesting article that could offer an explanation why Ranger can no longer break 7 minutes for 2K.

There was a link to this article at Rowing Illustrated

On the pitfalls of too much hard training: It appears the danger is muscle scarring ( my interpretation: and hence loss of elasticity of the heart and thus reduced stroke volume.) Perhaps that is why Ranger's max heart rate is still so high.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/03/0 ... ood-thing/

But half of the older lifelong athletes showed some heart muscle scarring. The affected men were, in each case, those who’d trained the longest and hardest.

Cue for the usual 3 WR's in 2003 and I'm so much better now. I am not suffering any of the described systems, my training is right on schedule, I am delighted, I will do a 6:16 2K soon, I will break all the 60's world records before the end of April, etc.

[ranger]

Let us pretend for sake of argument that Ranger actually does 20K on the erg every day and that he only takes good strokes (13 SPI) as he says he does. Here is an interesting article that could offer an explanation why Ranger can no longer break 7 minutes for 2K.

There was a link to this article at Rowing Illustrated

On the pitfalls of too much hard training: It appears the danger is muscle scarring ( my interpretation: and hence loss of elasticity of the heart and thus reduced stroke volume.) Perhaps that is why Ranger's max heart rate is still so high.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/03/0 ... ood-thing/

But half of the older lifelong athletes showed some heart muscle scarring. The affected men were, in each case, those who’d trained the longest and hardest.

Cue for the usual 3 WR's in 2003 and I'm so much better now. I am not suffering any of the described systems, my training is right on schedule, I am delighted, I will do a 6:16 2K soon, I will break all the 60's world records before the end of April, etc.

You're nutty, Byron.

I am going to row 7:00 2Ks for 70 minutes, no rest, a HM @ 1:45.

A FM at 1:48 predicts a HM at 1:45.

At 12 SPI, when I row 1:45 pace, I only have to rate 25 spm.

25 spm is pretty easy rowing.

With a drive of only .5 seconds, at 25 spm, I am still in close to a 4-to-1 ratio.

ranger

[aharmer]

Heck, I'm still waiting to see proof that he did a 1:34/32! Not a video for others to criticize, simply one line of data from his PM4 memory proving that the piece was actually done. Nothing. When you see this post will you either post the screenshot or give us another amusing excuse for why you're going to keep it to yourself? Thanks.

[Byron Drachman]

You're nutty, Byron.

I know you are but what am I?

I am going to row 7:00 2Ks for 70 minutes, no rest, a HM @ 1:45.
A FM at 1:48 predicts a HM at 1:45.

And I am going to run a sub-four minute mile (again.)
A two mile run in eight minutes predicts a sub-four minute mile.

I am going to have to do the sub-four minute mile again. I had the video of my sub-four minute mile all ready to post but the dog ate it.

[mikvan52]

Imagine (a lwt erger) pulls the 2K with flat splits at 1:34 and finishes in 6:16.


This has _never_ happened.

Nothing remotely like this has ever occurred.

It has been considered impossible.

Hey.

What can I say?

So it's clear: you agree you have no argument and no training plan to achieve 6:16.
I'm glad that's finally settled.

At last you've admitted it.
I am relieved.
Thank you so much for your honesty.

[ranger]

Imagine (a lwt erger) pulls the 2K with flat splits at 1:34 and finishes in 6:16.


This has _never_ happened.

Nothing remotely like this has ever occurred.

It has been considered impossible.

Hey.

What can I say?

So it's clear: you agree you have no argument and no training plan to achieve 6:16.
I'm glad that's finally settled.

At last you've admitted it.
I am relieved.
Thank you so much for your honesty.

My training is _done_, Mike.

I now row well (13 SPI) at low drag (119 df.).

I am now just preparing to race.

That's a no-brainer.

Everyone does it in the same way.

Standard training plans for rowing are race preparation.

The difficult thing is to figure out how to get better, as I have.

As a veteran, if you train to race, train to race, train to race, as the standard training plans for rowing guide you to do, you just get worse and worse.

Race preparation focusses on fitness, and as a veteran, your fitness is--inevitably--declining.

Nothing you can do about it.

ranger

P.S. If you want to know how I have gotten better, re-read my thousands of posts on this (and the British) forum for the last eight years: RWBs (learning how to be quick with my legs), work on sequencing (separation of levers), work on rhythm ("Steamrollering," etc.), sweep-rowing (work on length and relaxation), concentration of footwork (tapping the footplate), change of posture (sitting up straighter at the catch), discarding the towel and shoes, rowing OTW, lowering the drag, working on peak force, etc.

I have improved my technique.

[lancs]

How do you propose to make it to a FM @ 1:48 when you can't even reach 10k @1:48 (at whatever spm you choose)?

That's quite a shortfall, no?

If you are rowing at low UT1, steady state, there is no such thing as a shortfall.

You just row--pretty much as long as you want.

I see.

Ok. Well that means your UT1 is nowhere near 1:48 pace, probably 7 or 8 seconds slower.

That makes sense now.

Thanks for clearing that up ...

[mikvan52]

It appears the danger is muscle scarring

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/03/0 ... ood-thing/

I wonder if there is brain scarring too?


Byron: Have you noticed increase evidence of aphasia in our favorite lab rat? I have.
1. Inability to stay on subject
2. Increased incidence of emotional outbursts
3. Bizarre sense of humor
4. Delusions of grandeur

hmmm........

[ranger]

How do you propose to make it to a FM @ 1:48 when you can't even reach 10k @1:48 (at whatever spm you choose)?

That's quite a shortfall, no?

If you are rowing at low UT1, steady state, there is no such thing as a shortfall.

You just row--pretty much as long as you want.

I see.

Ok. Well that means your UT1 is nowhere near 1:48 pace, probably 7 or 8 seconds slower.

That makes sense now.

Thanks for clearing that up ...

Nope.

1:48 is _low_ UT1 (155 bpm).

Top-end UT1 (172 bpm) is 1:44.

I'll now row 1:44 for 60min, 17.3K.

First things first, though:

A FM @ 1:48 at low UT1 (155 bpm).

ranger

[Gus]

My training is _done_, Mike.

<snip>

I am now just training to race.

That's a no-brainer.

No doubt about that.

[mikvan52]

Imagine (a lwt erger) pulls the 2K with flat splits at 1:34 and finishes in 6:16.


This has _never_ happened.

Nothing remotely like this has ever occurred.

It has been considered impossible.

Hey.

What can I say?

So it's clear: you agree you have no argument and no training plan to achieve 6:16.
I'm glad that's finally settled.

At last you've admitted it.
I am relieved.
Thank you so much for your honesty.

My training is _done_, Mike.

I now row well (13 SPI) at low drag (119 df.).

I am now just training to race.

That's a no-brainer.

Everyone does it in the same way.

whoa, Nellie!
More evidence: Byron... the scarring is more advanced than I had ever thought possible.....(!)

ranger is now in a "no brain" (at all) situation... Wow!

Furthermore he thinks his training is done but he still needs to train... to race...(??????)
O-kee-dokee, I think we had better just humor him from here on out.
This is truly embarrassing for our professor who'll soon be going out to pasture.
I hear there's a bluff hugh over Lake Michigan advertising for a hermit/troll....
Show him the "Door".. after all.. he's the "cow-herd of the County"

and no Rich:
Everyone does not "do it the same way".
You don't do it at all.