Rowing Less Than An Hour Doesn't "Feel" Like A Wor

Liquid · Post by **Liquid** » July 27th, 2007, 3:05 pm

The type of workout I enjoy is the one that you can really feel in your muscles and where you have a nice deep sleep afterwards. I've been doing 10K's every day and recently did a 16.8K and 18.5K (same pace as 10K). Slept like a baby after the longer rows and could sense a difference in my body, overall the effects were much better than the 10K's.

Maybe I wasn't working out hard enough before, staying motivated on longer distances is more of a challenge. I try breaking it up into pieces "next mark to hit...12K" and thinking of what I have done instead of how much left I have to do. Music helps some.

Any techniques that others use to break up the monotony and keep the motivation going on longer rows? My other problem is that I get thirsty but each drink costs me 20-30 meters.

Gerhard · Post by **Gerhard** » July 27th, 2007, 3:40 pm

I just did a 4x2K, 5 minutes rest. Pace 1.05 * 2K PB. Feels like a real workout! Maybe you could add a weekly interval training to your LSD's?

PaulS · Post by **PaulS** » July 27th, 2007, 3:55 pm

If you are going nearly twice the distance at the same pace it's no surprise that the shorter distance doesn't stress you much. Speed up 5 seconds in pace for 10k and see how it goes.

Gerhards suggestion is good. IOW, a single 1k can easily be enough to lead to a nice nights sleep, that is, after you stop crying from the pain.

Snail Space · Post by **Snail Space** » July 27th, 2007, 4:07 pm

I have recently increased my standard training session to a 60' row.

I structure each session as a Wolverine Plan level 4 session in which the time is split up into short epochs, each of 1, 2, 3, or 4 minutes (2 minutes is the most common). Each epoch has a prescribed spm and target pace. So a 10' segment might have 2 minute epochs of e.g.:

18spm@2:08; 20spm@2:04; 18spm@2:08; 20spm@2:04; 18spm@2:08

The concentration required to stick to the prescribed rate & pace helps the hour to tick by without you noticing.

I can't use music because earphones irritate me, and I can't use loudspeakers because I row before 06:00hr (when the rest of the family are asleep).

You can avoid the need to drink during the exercise if you take up to a litre of water immediately before you get on the ergo. I drink 750ml whilst I am dressing in my training kit.

Cheers
Dave

alexthecheese · Post by **alexthecheese** » July 30th, 2007, 3:19 pm

I'm new and I struggle to imagine what it'd be like to row for a solid hour! 20 mins at the moment is enough for me, though I expect one day, when I get my 5k down, I might make the change up to 10k.

Speaking of which - I'm doing 1:55ish splits for 5k, what would you recommend for 10k? 2...10?

jbell · Post by **jbell** » July 30th, 2007, 10:35 pm

If you are holding 1:55 for 5k, then I would say hold ~2:05 for your first 10k. If you feel it wasn't too bad, go for 2:00.

ckaiserca · Post by **ckaiserca** » July 31st, 2007, 11:32 pm

Has anyone tried rowing with a CamelBak?

Nosmo · Post by **Nosmo** » August 1st, 2007, 12:19 am

ckaiserca wrote:Has anyone tried rowing with a CamelBak?

DOn't think I would want to wear one, but you could set it on something next to the machine about head height and just reach over and put the tube in your mouth at regular intervals and keep rowing. You may need to get an extension tube, which are cheap. You could rig something up with bungee cords so the tube goes back to the same place when you let go with your mouth. You will loose very little time this way.

Liquid · Post by **Liquid** » August 2nd, 2007, 1:24 pm

I read on the internet that it is better to break up long rows, helps to reduce fat. Tried 4 5K's yesterday with 12 minute breaks in between. I seem to get more blisters with longer sessions, had six yesterday in new places.

icomefrombirmingham · Post by **icomefrombirmingham** » August 2nd, 2007, 2:13 pm

alexthecheese wrote:I'm new and I struggle to imagine what it'd be like to row for a solid hour! 20 mins at the moment is enough for me, though I expect one day, when I get my 5k down, I might make the change up to 10k.

Speaking of which - I'm doing 1:55ish splits for 5k, what would you recommend for 10k? 2...10?

How new?
Two months ago when I started I was doing 10 minutes and felt like I'd played a game of rugby! Two months later and I can do a HM in 90 minutes....not fast but I'm not counting.
I think it's a case of getting used to a new motion. I'm sure you'll be doing 60' and HMs and very soon, you're certainly in better shape than I am.
Now if I could maintain my 1.54 500m for 2K I'd feel I was making progress....or even for 1K.
Brent

DavidA · Post by **DavidA** » August 8th, 2007, 2:17 pm

ckaiserca wrote:Has anyone tried rowing with a CamelBak?

I have done it a few times, during FMs, with no trouble.
Others don't like it.
As with most things there are many factors involved for each person. Try it and see how it works for you.

David

Gerhard · Post by **Gerhard** » August 9th, 2007, 5:06 am

icomefrombirmingham wrote:
alexthecheese wrote:I'm new and I struggle to imagine what it'd be like to row for a solid hour! 20 mins at the moment is enough for me, though I expect one day, when I get my 5k down, I might make the change up to 10k.

Speaking of which - I'm doing 1:55ish splits for 5k, what would you recommend for 10k? 2...10?
How new?
Two months ago when I started I was doing 10 minutes and felt like I'd played a game of rugby! Two months later and I can do a HM in 90 minutes....not fast but I'm not counting.
I think it's a case of getting used to a new motion. I'm sure you'll be doing 60' and HMs and very soon, you're certainly in better shape than I am.
Now if I could maintain my 1.54 500m for 2K I'd feel I was making progress....or even for 1K.
Brent

Brent,

May I ask you what your stroke rate is when you row 1 hour or a HM? I'm really impressed with your long distance times, especially when compared to your shorted distances and considering the fact that you are only rowing for 2 months. You show no sign of fatigue whatsoever (your 60m pace is faster than your 30 minute pace?). I'm wondering if I keep my stroke rate ro low for longer distances, using to much power and therefore not able to sustain it for long periods.

(I did my first 10K @ 26 SPM yesterday. Normally do 22SPM. Took 73 seconds of my PB. I was exhausted, but not 'drained' like I normally am...)

Nimrod Troyte · Post by **Nimrod Troyte** » August 9th, 2007, 8:05 am

Gerhard,

I'm erging at about 26-30spm for every distance. It certainly hurts, but I feel I have no choice seeing as my inside leg is only 29".

I may be doing it wrong though.

Cheers,

Jim

icomefrombirmingham · Post by **icomefrombirmingham** » August 9th, 2007, 9:40 am

Gerhard wrote:
icomefrombirmingham wrote:
alexthecheese wrote:I'm new and I struggle to imagine what it'd be like to row for a solid hour! 20 mins at the moment is enough for me, though I expect one day, when I get my 5k down, I might make the change up to 10k.

Speaking of which - I'm doing 1:55ish splits for 5k, what would you recommend for 10k? 2...10?
How new?
Two months ago when I started I was doing 10 minutes and felt like I'd played a game of rugby! Two months later and I can do a HM in 90 minutes....not fast but I'm not counting.
I think it's a case of getting used to a new motion. I'm sure you'll be doing 60' and HMs and very soon, you're certainly in better shape than I am.
Now if I could maintain my 1.54 500m for 2K I'd feel I was making progress....or even for 1K.
Brent
Brent,

May I ask you what your stroke rate is when you row 1 hour or a HM? I'm really impressed with your long distance times, especially when compared to your shorted distances and considering the fact that you are only rowing for 2 months. You show no sign of fatigue whatsoever (your 60m pace is faster than your 30 minute pace?). I'm wondering if I keep my stroke rate ro low for longer distances, using to much power and therefore not able to sustain it for long periods.

(I did my first 10K @ 26 SPM yesterday. Normally do 22SPM. Took 73 seconds of my PB. I was exhausted, but not 'drained' like I normally am...)

Hi Gerhard,
Thank you for the compliment!

To be completely honest, I am more impressed by the fact that I am still alive at the end of a HM than with my time!!

First, the caveat....once I get into my work-out I am trying hard to concentrate on breathing regularly....I don't mean that as a joke.....I mean I actually have to concentrate on a regular breathing rythm or else I am breathing in on the drive one minute and out on the drive the next.
It then becomes difficult for me to establish a smooth stroke. So, if I focus on the screen it is more to see how much time is left than SR or Watts or splits. I hope that when I am fitter, or get a log card, that I will be able to remember more of the statistics.

Having said that, my stroke rate has fallen quite a lot since I started out. At the beginning I was struggling to do 10:00 minutes....on May 27th (my first time on an erg) I did 1,954m in 10:04 minutes and was beat. I think my stroke rate was 27-28 SPM...which for several weeks seemed to me like my natural rythm.
I then rowed next to an experienced rower and saw how smooth she rowed and how much her SR was less than mine, yet from the sound of the fly-wheel she seemed to be getting lots of power. So I decided to concentrate on technigue. I got some books out of the library and watched some of the YouTube videos from one of the threads here.

Now, I am rowing at around 24-25 SPM for most of the 60' or HM. If there is a chance of a PB my tendancy is to up the stroke rate at the end. But, I have noticed that upping the SR often leads to less m/stroke. When I am rowing in control, at 24-25 SPM, I can get 10m/stroke very consistently...when I start to panic, my stroke rate increases but my m/stroke drops...so I don't think I am further ahead.

In these situations the discipline to maintain the technique (such as it is!) is difficult for me, but I am finding it to be beneficial/essential.

I hadn't noticed that my 60' distances are better than my 30'!! But yes you are right. This is probably because I was doing a lot of 60' minutes pieces with usually one HM per week thrown in. So my 30' times are older. I did a 7,401 30' on Monday but hadn't updated it on my signature. I wouldn't say I show no sign of fatigue...it's more that I'm equally fatigued at 30', 60' or HM!!
However, now that you mention it, after a couple of minutes of panting and dripping sweat at the end of a longer pieces...and after drinking a LOT of water (which I didn't do even a few weeks ago) I do feel pretty good. I generally go home and walk the dogs afterwards.

I have thought about this a lot. Clearly I am not using all of my energy on the erg. However, I want to get down to something like a decent weight (currently 254 lbs...decent would be <220) and have a serious chat with my cardiologist! before I really concentrate on speeding up. This assumes speeding up is even possible for me...I was always a cross-country runner at school (decades ago!) never a sprinter.

I have just done my first two 10ks....41:44 and 41:11...this distance seems to me to be a nice compromise between 2k which I am no good at and HMs which take too much time some days.

Now, back to you...if I could maintain 1.54-1.55 over 2k...let alone 5k I'd be in heaven...ummm perhaps that wasn't well put.....I'd be planning my Masters OTW career!! And 73 seconds off your 10K PB in one go is amazing!! Congratulations!!

Long answer, sorry. The short answer is 23-24 IF I have the MENTAL energy to maintain that rate.

Regards,
Brent

Bob S. · Post by **Bob S.** » August 9th, 2007, 2:34 pm

icomefrombirmingham wrote: Now, I am rowing at around 24-25 SPM for most of the 60' or HM. If there is a chance of a PB my tendancy is to up the stroke rate at the end. But, I have noticed that upping the SR often leads to less m/stroke. When I am rowing in control, at 24-25 SPM, I can get 10m/stroke very consistently...when I start to panic, my stroke rate increases but my m/stroke drops...so I don't think I am further ahead.
Brent

Why do you consider m/stroke? There is no direct measure of this on the monitor and it is very difficult to try to judge it from the change in meters. If you increase the rate, it would be amazing if the m/stroke didn't decrease. What counts in this case is the pace (or watts or calories/time). That is the real measure of how well you are doing. If your pace slows (or stays the same) when you increase the rate, then you know that it isn't effective. Even that is not as definitive as most of us would like, since pace is rounded off (or perhaps truncated) to the nearest second/500m. Watts would be a better measure, since there is a larger change in the number of watts than in the number of seconds/500m, at least for pace levels in the usual range, 1:00 to 2:50.

Bob S.