Alternative to full squats?

[bisqeet]

I do a bit of gym work - either 2-3 times a week.
mostly preventive maintenance, nothing heavy - usually circuit training or REHA gymnastics (knee and back; l4-l5-s1).

I usually do legs on the machines, including a squat. I guess i'm not the weakest guy in the pack, but definetly not the most powerful either.
I don't usually have a problem maxing out the stacks on the machines tho.

the only thing is - i have no cartlidge on the right knee and no meniscus on either (who knew jumping out of perfectly servicable aircraft with 60kg strapped to your back wasn't healthy in the long run),
what this means is that i can't really trust my knees to carry that much load past 100° (90° max) - the sound of the bone on bone clicking (rather like pulling a chicken wing apart) is a little distracting - the pain usually comes afterwards - followed by limping..

on the machine i can limit the distance (inside angle of knee usually between 100-170°) - which is no problem, but i'm missing a lot of movement compared to a free "full squat".

any alternative excersizes that could compensate here? how important is a "full squat" compared to my machine "partial squat" ?

[Drivetofast]

Landmine reverse lunges, Box squats, Pull a sled or a old Tire, Deadlifts, Fill a wheelbarrow and walk around. Buy some knee wraps, Lots of advil Just a few and they are knee friendly

[aussieluke]

So you can squat to full depth with a mother weight?

If so I would consider the goblet squat with a kettlebell for a very full rom squat movement, which is also great for hip, flute, quad and hamstring strength and flexibility - think movement quality not load.

You could then add some heavy work with trap bar deadlifts or regular deadlifts.

I would definitely avoid the machines

[bisqeet]

So you can squat to full depth with a mother weight?

If so I would consider the goblet squat with a kettlebell for a very full rom squat movement, which is also great for hip, flute, quad and hamstring strength and flexibility - think movement quality not load.

You could then add some heavy work with trap bar deadlifts or regular deadlifts.

I would definitely avoid the machines

nope - i restrict it to the machine - or box squats (but still the box is quite high)
if you think about the angle of thigh / shin where the thigh is parallel to the floor is about 90° - i try not to go lower than 100° with weight.
deadlifts are a good idea - i will inegrate them into my sessions.

the problem is the lack of cartlidge, so at a 90° angle its really is bone on bone, and the initial push is just not so good.
i can get away with the odd stroke in rowing as there is little load on there.

[aussieluke]

I think I meant a lighter weight above btw

Can you do unweighted / bodyweight squats?

[bisqeet]

I think I meant a lighter weight above btw

Can you do unweighted / bodyweight squats?

same restrictions :/
i just avoid going below 90°

[Cyclist2]

I do step ups with a weighted bar across my shoulders. You can adjust the height of the bench to limit the knee flexion when you step up. Adjusting the weight, obviously, makes it harder or easier.

[mdpfirrman]

My one knee sounds a lot like your knees Dean. I still (stubbornly) do squats, but not a lot of them. If I do them, it's not with a lot of weight (maybe 70 or 80 lbs - 35kg or so).

What does a squat work - glutes, hamstrings and quads. Here's a couple of other options I do.

Heavy KB swings - the advantage a full squat is it works your hips well. The heavy KB swings work your quads (not a lot) but really works your hips and your glutes just a bit. Also a great warmup for the rower.

Another great one is a KB pendulum deadlift. It's fantastic for hamstrings. Another great workout for the hamstrings is bridges with heavy kettlebells on your waist to add weight. I do single leg bridges for added challenge.

I also do KB deadlifts with two KBs and alternate those with cleans to bring to the shoulders and then execute shoulder presses.

Stairmaster - I love the stairmaster. I use it to do forward lunges. If you put the stairmaster on a decent clip, you can skip steps and basically do a lunge movement that isn't horrible on your bad knee. People with cartilage don't' realize that the back knee is the one that struggles on a lunge (more than the front knee).

Another exercise (a simple one) is stand on a staircase facing downward. While holding one leg on the the stair, do toe touches on the floor below. That will really cause a massive quad burn.

Floor work (with ankle weights) is also great for glutes. Put ankle weight on and from all fours on the floor lift one of your legs up and to the side. Painful glute work.

Elastic bands are also great if they have a leg cuff for straight leg rear raises.

[Droode]

Improving the strength and flexibility of your hamstrings can help alleviate painful knees and increasing the strength of your posterior chain can improve your overall athleticism as much as quad dominate exercises. Think kettlebell swing, romanian deadlift, glute ham raise, deadlift, etc.

[mdpfirrman]

Oddly, I forgot my favorite new exercise. This one is fantastic for developing leg power and (for me at least) if you don't pull it up from the floor, not hard on your knees. One arm power snatches. If I can do these, you certainly should be able to. Great explosive leg exercise. Not hard to do either.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1zGGVGkOEE

[Anth_F]

Oddly, I forgot my favorite new exercise. This one is fantastic for developing leg power and (for me at least) if you don't pull it up from the floor, not hard on your knees. One arm power snatches. If I can do these, you certainly should be able to. Great explosive leg exercise. Not hard to do either.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1zGGVGkOEE

Nice... i do the full pull up from the ground ones. But some times it can be a bit hard on the knees, so i think substitute them for this style/technique. And i really like the explosive action in the exercise here.

In fact, it's leg day for me tomorrow so i'm gonna try these out.

[bisqeet]

some great proposals / alternatives.
Think I might have to invest in some heavier kettlebells
landmine reverse lunges look doable and box squats if i can find the right box.
Will be implementing a few of these methinks

thanks everyone

[mdpfirrman]

Oddly, I forgot my favorite new exercise. This one is fantastic for developing leg power and (for me at least) if you don't pull it up from the floor, not hard on your knees. One arm power snatches. If I can do these, you certainly should be able to. Great explosive leg exercise. Not hard to do either.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1zGGVGkOEE

Nice... i do the full pull up from the ground ones. But some times it can be a bit hard on the knees, so i think substitute them for this style/technique. And i really like the explosive action in the exercise here.

In fact, it's leg day for me tomorrow so i'm gonna try these out.

I've never done much power lifting, but these are surprisingly (to me) simple. I get a few stares at the gym (they look more "bad ass" than they really are).

[aussieluke]

Oddly, I forgot my favorite new exercise. This one is fantastic for developing leg power and (for me at least) if you don't pull it up from the floor, not hard on your knees. One arm power snatches. If I can do these, you certainly should be able to. Great explosive leg exercise. Not hard to do either.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1zGGVGkOEE

Things like this can look more effective or hardcore or whatever, but as with kettlebell snatches too, you'd most likely be much better off doing better quality kettlebell swings.

Not many things other than heavy deadlifts and barbell snatches, cleans and power cleans will come close for glute, hip and hamstring strength and power in one simple movement. Plus, done right, swings will be great for your back, "core", shoulders, posture.....

[mdpfirrman]

I like them both Luke honestly. I probably do 50 to 100 KB swings now 3 days a week (I was doing daily but that got to be too much). I also figured out I was doing them incorrectly the first month to so. They do work your hips really well (and your core and your back a bit). I do feel them in my glutes too but not as much for my quads. For the quads, I prefer the squats or the power snatches. Just feel it more. Both moves will have you ridiculously out of breath very quickly. I like both of them because you're working fast twitch muscle fibers with both exercises. Just variety.