Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

General discussion on Training. How to get better on your erg, how to use your erg to get better at another sport, or anything else about improving your abilities.
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mininick
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by mininick » October 4th, 2016, 4:22 pm

Pie Man wrote:Nick sensible attitude to have, I'm currently looking for a job that involves me erging for around up to an hour a day six days a week, no luck so far but I live in hope...
Let me know if you find it! If you do, as I'm on the BPP I wonder if they offer part time hours, as well?
mudgeg wrote:@mininick - don't let the rowing effect the singing. What a great job, opera is my favourite genre of music, listen to it all the time when working. Got into it when a student in London as the father of one of my colleagues used to sing in the chorus of the Royal Opera and he got us free tickets all the time. Unfortunately have to pay now. Not great to row to though, prefer the Eagles for that.
I agree with it not being a perfect soundtrack for rowing! I'm sure there are some things that would work...maybe that's another topic! I do love my job...many of my friends work at Covent Garden and I get to go quite often. Not sure any of them do erging...the frustrating thing is that long term, erging should help build my abdominal strength which would be good for singing. I will go harder again when these auditions are out of the way.

@Litewite, @mudgeg and @slacker - you are all my BPP motivators, along with others. Really good sessions from all three of you.
M29, 165cm/5' 5", 81kg

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jackarabit
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by jackarabit » October 4th, 2016, 5:07 pm

Pete 3.1.3
Endurovals
Pace target: 2:06 previous
Df120
2k WP w/ 10-stroke bursts to 2:05
2600m CD

Nasty mess.

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There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

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G-dub
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by G-dub » October 4th, 2016, 5:07 pm

Slacker wrote:Mike: Interesting that the PP 500m intervals are on 3:30 rest and the BPP is on 2min rest. Must be to keep us newbies from trying to go too fast, but it's the same all the way thru the end of the BPP. So, I'm not really sure why it is that way, but that's what the plan says.

Glenn: It was more than just what the target pace should be. More thoughts about how to row a 500m (pacing strategy and rates). Maybe just be because I'm new and haven't done many of these. If I rate low I'm sure my legs will give out at some point, but when I try to rate up but maintain pace, I feel that get out of breathe very quickly. Still working on that balance. Most of these I started quickly and then tapered to try and settle out on a target, but the last one I started slow and built up to the average in the first 15 seconds or so and then held steady for the rest of the distance.
I may be jumping (with a long reply) into a conversation that you have found the answer to. I think there is a difference between rowing a 500 on its own and rowing one in an interval session. On its own its balls to the wall and rating as fast as you can until the finish. There is a little pacing strategy in it, but most seem to just go as hard as can and actually positive split or "fly and die".

The 500 intervals, however, have the reality of having to do more than one and also having to recover between them. So pacing in terms of the pace you set out to do on each interval as well as pacing across all the intervals comes into play. So when I mentioned to do the next ones at your average of this past one, I was referring to how we do it in the Pete Plan. It gives you a pace target that is doable - especially since you had so much left in the tank.

Most of us flat pace across intervals or drop a little each time. But I think probably the best way to do it is to keep a steady pace on each of the intervals and then hit the last one or two with more gusto. This will reset your average for the next time and make you feel like a champ. The key, I think, is to do all of them so that you are getting volume at a fast pace. You don't want to short change yourself by thinking that you need to go too hard and then hit a wall. Some of us might be getting to a point where we can put ourselves on the line a little more, but that is because we have done lots of them and know what to expect or have other indications that it might be possible. Or because we need to kick ourselves in the butt every now and again.

In terms of each 500 within an interval session, I tend to crank the first 15-20 strokes at a decent clip and then settle in for the rest of the interval. In reality, I sort of positive split them because I allow the average pace to come up from the beginning blast and I usually have an average pace in mind from the beginning. It creates a sort of table looking pace graph where the beginning is fast, the middle less fast and the end fast again. This is not ideal per se and probably wrong, but it is what I've always done (I like getting into each interval a little aggressively from a mind set standpoint and 500's are fairly short and I don't want to get too far behind). You might find that flat or a little negative works best for you and if so, I would use that. In fact its probably more correct to do it that way. I also try to pick a rate goal at the beginning that matches proportionally with a pace target so that the stroke feels the same from one pace to the next and ideally the same when I am doing a 2K. I am not sure that it really does, but many have said it does, so I go with it. However, as I get to the last few and my legs are getting tired, I up the rate (probably unintentionally) to stay on pace rather than blowing up or losing pace. Unfortunately, I can't tell you what to rate at but I would use the next interval session to explore that a little. I do think that building a strong stroke is important, so I wouldn't go crazy with rate while you are learning about yourself. I am going a little high at the moment, but I am searching for some more speed right now and I'm testing my fitness to handle the rate. Usually I would be trying to use a heavier stroke to build power. And you are right, lower hits the legs more and higher hits the lungs more. You need to find your balance based on your fitness and power. Hopefully a real erger will chime in and give you better or more direct advice than this!
Glenn Walters: 5'-8" X 192 lbs. Bday 01/09/1962
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S-man
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by S-man » October 4th, 2016, 5:53 pm

Today, PP week7, day3 5 x 1500 r5’ Last time I did this at 2:11.1 r23, so the plan was to aim for 2:11 r23 for the first 3 intervals and then pick up the pace and rate.
1. 2:11.2 r23
2. 2:10.8 r23
3. 2:10.4 r23
4. 2:09.8 r24
5. 2:08.5 r25
Average 2:10.1 r23-24
Happy to drop the average by 1s from last time. Felt comfortable at r23 but got a lot tougher at 24-25 spm – CV fitness (or rather lack of it :lol: ) still a big issue.
Sanz

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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by G-dub » October 4th, 2016, 6:21 pm

Good one Sanz.

I did less than my required steady distance meters today. About 7500 r 21 2:06.5. Everything tired today.
Glenn Walters: 5'-8" X 192 lbs. Bday 01/09/1962
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jackarabit
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by jackarabit » October 4th, 2016, 6:31 pm

My intervals usually exhibit the "parson's table" pace graph that Glenn mentions. I don't drive the pace as low from the start as I did last year because floating back up to target pace on soft strokes postpones the moment of digging in to produce hard repeatable strokes. Notwithstanding, the alactic energy system is quick recovery so might as well
practice using it. Same with the sprint. Always sprint or at least attempt to sprint.
There are two types of people in this world: Those who can extrapolate from incomplete data

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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by Goldenbarry » October 4th, 2016, 6:44 pm

Jack, John, Piers & Mike thanks for the comments and suggestions following my fly and die 2k PB attempt. I plan on grinding through the workouts for another month or so before testing myself again.

Nick good choice to take it easy and best of luck with your auditions. That's very cool!

Strong long rows Gordon, Rohan and Tim. Jack, going by your heart rate it certainly wasn't lack of effort that caused you miss your target split by a second. Good stuff.

Weights followed by the optional week 6 5k for me tonight.

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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by Slacker » October 4th, 2016, 6:45 pm

Jack: Thanks for breaking things down for us. Understanding why helps a lot. What's up with your sessions lately? Just feeling off? Mentally off your game? Noticed you've had a few down rows lately.

Glen: The thoughts help. I need to think on and mull over things a bit more than many I guess, but really it comes down to just doing more of them and seeing what works.

Tim: your 8000m is a lot quicker than I can do right now. I bet you can get pretty close based off of your 500m intervals last week.

Gordon: Good job. It does seem like a lot of extra distance when you think about it. This thinking of things in 500m pace is deceiving as a second or two quicker works out to be a lot of time at these distances.

Nick: All you can do is put in the work. We all have issues. Many guys here are traveling or sick now. I've been able to work around my schedule thus far, but will have times here in the coming months that I may have to miss a bunch.

Rohan: more nice work for the logbook. Anxious to see what you do after your week off.
Ben
5' 11" 153 lbs

Pie Man
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by Pie Man » October 4th, 2016, 6:51 pm

Nice rows Tim, Gordon and Sanz, it's all coming along nicely.

Ouch Jack, do you know what went wrong with those two reps? Everything else was on target.

I was supposed to do 5 x 1500 @ 1:55 today, did a 2k warm up with 10 sub 1:55 pulls every 500m and I was just aware of my back, only the tinniest niggle so decided to bail on that and go for a 10k attempt as it's the c2ctc.com test this month. Managed to pace it like I normally do really with a turgid start, first 1000m @ 2:04, first 3000m at 2:02.5, ok middle next 5000m @ 1:59.7, 1100m to go so close to HD, was @2:00.5 at that point then pulled a few 2:08's+, decided to just finish it as I was so close. Pace increased up again, got into a rhythm and nudged into 1:59 pulls. Then I hit the last 500m and in my normal manic self took over, started to hold 1:50, then 1:48's final pull was a 1:46... MHR hit 169 2 more than my previous 'best' To finish in....

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Shame I can't pull 1:46's at 30spm without a 9990m warm up :)

Very pleased with a sub 40:00 10k, with better pacing I could do better, but probably not a lot.
Piers 53m was 73Kg 175cm to 2019 now 78kg
500m 1:34 (HW 2020) 2k 7:09.5 (2017 LWT) 10k 39:58.9 (2016 LWT) HM 1:28:26.9 (2017 LWT)

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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by G-dub » October 4th, 2016, 7:05 pm

A nice milestone reached, Piers. More to come for you for sure. You are making great progress, my good man.
Glenn Walters: 5'-8" X 192 lbs. Bday 01/09/1962
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by S-man » October 5th, 2016, 1:43 am

Great row Piers! Was about to congratulate you for being sensible and listening to your back, and then you pull a first sub 40 10k :D Nice!

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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by aussieluke » October 5th, 2016, 3:47 am

Paul, I assume Piers sprinted at the end and that is the final stroke rate and not the overall average
Male, 35, 5'10", 78kg
Started rowing Feb 2016
500m 1:33.2
2000m 6:57.4
5000m 18:47.6

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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by aussieluke » October 5th, 2016, 3:50 am

PP week 3 day 2

15000m 2:08.3 r22 (1:04:15)

Couple of breaks for water and walk around (20', 20', 24')
Male, 35, 5'10", 78kg
Started rowing Feb 2016
500m 1:33.2
2000m 6:57.4
5000m 18:47.6

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JohnAd
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by JohnAd » October 5th, 2016, 3:53 am

Gordon, there's always the 2nd attempt in the week to go for the extra second, congrats on getting half way to 10k, I think the extra 500m start to feel smaller from here.

Tim, good solid sessions.

Sanz, good to see those seconds still falling off, no plateaus yet.

Piers, there must be something in the air with PBs all over the place, nice sprint at the end to get under 40mins

Missed my SS yesterday with the very lame excuse that I left my kit at home, will have to atone by pushing the 5x1500

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bisqeet
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Re: Pete Plan Group - Startup Aug 20th thru 22nd

Post by bisqeet » October 5th, 2016, 5:01 am

I'm afraid I've missed the last few days. Just too much.
I think I mentioned it, but I won a four week gym membership, which I try and get the most out of, plus the usual UT2 stuff and some OTW stuff on top.
Adding the PP to that load was just very tiring (but fun).
going to just keep doing mostly UT2 stuff/ gym /OTW until the freebie runs out.

my laast few workouts...
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Dean
2020 Season: 196cm / 96kg : M51
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~seven days without rowing makes one weak~

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