Rowing to improve running

[pjwerneck]

Hello,

I used to be in very good shape about an year ago, but for several reasons I gained a lot of weight, so I'm doing the weight loss workout from the concept2.co.uk website. It's working very well. However, I need to run 3k and do a strength circuit for a fitness test in about 3 months from now. I'm ok with the circuit, and I'm mostly concerned with the running. I'm limited to low impact training for a while, so I can't run now and decided to focus on rowing. I have about 1 hour a day for training, and I have a model D at home.

Any recommendations on what kind of rowing workout I should do to improve that 3k run? I'm aiming at 15:00 or less. I usually do the weight loss program workout first, then after that I like to do the 2000, 1500, 1000, 500 with 2:00r workout, 4 days a week. Once a week I'm doing a HIIT, usually 6 sets of 40s at 85-90% MHR and with 2:00 at 70-80%. My current 2k is 8:26, and my 500m is 1:43.8.

[j1huegel]

I assume you are still running indoors or on treadmill? You'll have to train those muscle systems to work well.

That said, the Cardio benefit you get from rowing will complement your running well. I'd recommend long slow rows of 10k/day at lower efforts, mixed with some speed or intervals. 3k is pretty short, but the aerobic base you get from longer rows will help you a lot.

[ArmandoChavezUNC]

In my experience rowing fitness doesn't really translate to running fitness at all. It will get you in better shape, but I don't think it'll make you much faster running. That being said, you'll make better gains once you start running by virtue of being in better overall cardiovascular shape.

[Carl Watts]

Not sure about other peoples experiences but the rowing didn't help my running a whole lot.

I had to do some serious actual running, well it was jogging really to be able to complete 2.4km in 12 minutes flat. Darn near killed me.

This is really, really slow if you watch someone at this pace, yet my rowing stats wouldn't reflect that kind of performance expectation. I was lapped at the finish line with another lap to go by "Runners"

The rowing will be great for no impact weight loss, however if you want to get good at running as well then you have to run.

[hjs]

Hello,

I used to be in very good shape about an year ago, but for several reasons I gained a lot of weight, so I'm doing the weight loss workout from the concept2.co.uk website. It's working very well. However, I need to run 3k and do a strength circuit for a fitness test in about 3 months from now. I'm ok with the circuit, and I'm mostly concerned with the running. I'm limited to low impact training for a while, so I can't run now and decided to focus on rowing. I have about 1 hour a day for training, and I have a model D at home.

Any recommendations on what kind of rowing workout I should do to improve that 3k run? I'm aiming at 15:00 or less. I usually do the weight loss program workout first, then after that I like to do the 2000, 1500, 1000, 500 with 2:00r workout, 4 days a week. Once a week I'm doing a HIIT, usually 6 sets of 40s at 85-90% MHR and with 2:00 at 70-80%. My current 2k is 8:26, and my 500m is 1:43.8.

Rowing is power endurance, to mimic running use a light as possible stroke, low drag, high rate, good rowers are often poor runners, rowing uses to much muscle compared to running, so runners are to heavy.

[phlukke]

for what its worth I totally agree with Carl. good luck tho'

[pjwerneck]

I assume you are still running indoors or on treadmill? You'll have to train those muscle systems to work well.

No, not at all. I tried to run while overweight and the result was right knee chondromalacia and left achilles tendinitis. I focused on strength training and weight loss and for now the pain is gone, I can row fine and don't feel anything, as long as I don't row barefoot, but I'm really afraid of getting back to running until I lose at least another 20lb, which should be within the timeframe I have.

I guess I'll have to get back to running earlier then.

Not sure about other peoples experiences but the rowing didn't help my running a whole lot.

I had to do some serious actual running, well it was jogging really to be able to complete 2.4km in 12 minutes flat. Darn near killed me.

That's about the same pace I'll have to do, so, thanks for the encouragement.

I guess I can only count on some CV improvement then.

Rowing is power endurance, to mimic running use a light as possible stroke, low drag, high rate, good rowers are often poor runners, rowing uses to much muscle compared to running, so runners are to heavy.

What about the opposite, mimic rowing when running? 3k is pretty short, so maybe doing short sprints combined with long recoveries I might be able to make it faster overall than jogging all the time?

[hjs]

Rowing is power endurance, to mimic running use a light as possible stroke, low drag, high rate, good rowers are often poor runners, rowing uses to much muscle compared to running, so runners are to heavy.

What about the opposite, mimic rowing when running? 3k is pretty short, so maybe doing short sprints combined with long recoveries I might be able to make it faster overall than jogging all the time?

Look how a middle distance runner is build, power is no where needed, every sport above 1 minute, certainly when it is weight bearing aerobic fitness is number one.
If you have a stepper availeble use that, rowing is a poor substitute for running. Rowers make poor runners

[Carl Watts]

Have to agree, it's a low weight sport as soon as you go any distance over like 800M.

You only have to watch the Olympics to see how the build of the top runners changes from the 100M to the FM to see what I mean.

I was at the back of the feild with the rugby players and the big blokes all weighing in over 100kg and it was not a pretty sight.

So wish the fitness test was done on the Erg instead, would have blitzed everyone !

[Cyclingman1]

The flow from what athletes in one sport can do in another sport, when it comes to endurance, is always from running to the other sport. I know that from having been a pretty decent runner, though relatively big, to my inclusion of cycling many years ago and more recently, indoor rowing. The aerobic and anerobic fitness that one obtains in running, assuming one is a dedicated athlete, is unmatched in other sports. In neither cycling or rowing, does the athlete have to support his or her own weight. That is the difference. Cross country skiing probably comes close to running in fitness levels, but I would wonder how well skiers adapt to running.

[Bob S.]

Cross country skiing probably comes close to running in fitness levels, but I would wonder how well skiers adapt to running.

Dr. Kenneth Cooper (who coined the word aerobics) included cross country skiing in his extensive studies many years ago and rated that as the most aerobically demanding activity of all those he studied. Of course that does not address the issue raised in Cyclingman's post, since there is a lot more involved than aerobic conditioning.

Bob S.

[quickstepper]

This is solely my personal experience so take it for what it's worth...

I consider myself a decent runner and I've always wanted to run, and run well. However each time I really start getting into a good rhythm and getting OK times my body gives out. Due to over pronation and probably just a size issue (6'1", ~175lbs) it's an uphill battle for me. It seems my body doesn't like speeds in excess of 10mph (my 10K gets in the 36-38 min range). Everything from IT band, PFS and now some interesting pain just below my knee on the outside that I'm trying to figure out what it is.

In any case... With respect to rowing and running it may not go hand in hand but I've found one of the great things is that rowing has increased my pain threshold immensely. I only started rowing this year (due to running injuries) but the speeds that used to be difficult and painful (in a cardio perspective) to me are now a joke because of the rowing sessions I've done. But this brings me back to what a lot of people on this forum have said... Rowing does not make good runners.... I love the car analogy... The engine is strong/powerful but the chassis is weak. Rowing has definitely compounded the injuries for me. So much so that I don't really like taking the chance of running, feeling how easy it is and ending up blasting my knee. So I've upped my rowing mileage considerably

But if you must run and row, make sure you increase your running mileage gradually to lower the risk of injury.

Remember friends don't let friends row and run

[Bob S.]

Rowing has definitely compounded the injuries for me.

Can you be a bit more specific about that? What sort of injuries were made worse by rowing? It would be good to know what to watch out for with that sort of problem.

Bob S.

[RBFC]

The injury you describe on the outside of your leg just below the knee sounds like ilio-tibial band syndrome:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iliotibial_band_syndrome

Your pre-existing injuries are probably worse after running faster because the rowing raised your lactate tolerance and increased your overall fitness. This increased fitness allows you to run faster, which places much higher dynamic stresses on your joints. So, your pre-existing injury sites are being stressed harder than ever before. While running faster is not a bad thing, it can be detrimental in the presence of problems like you describe. A better comparison would be to run your 10K at the same pace you used to, looking at your HR data to examine your fitness gains. Without the same familiarity (frequency) of running, you'll find that the "specialization" you developed for running is decreased. Rowing will get you fitter, but not prepare you totally for running.

A good pair of orthotic shoe devices (arch supports) can go a long way toward fixing many of the problems caused by overpronation (including the ones you listed). Your leg, all the way from hip to toes, will function in better alignment and allow your joints to move through a less-injurious track. You may find that the increased efficiency and proper structure will allow you to run faster without repercussions.

Lee

[Robert Wildes]

The flow from what athletes in one sport can do in another sport, when it comes to endurance, is always from running to the other sport. I know that from having been a pretty decent runner, though relatively big, to my inclusion of cycling many years ago and more recently, indoor rowing. The aerobic and anerobic fitness that one obtains in running, assuming one is a dedicated athlete, is unmatched in other sports. In neither cycling or rowing, does the athlete have to support his or her own weight. That is the difference. Cross country skiing probably comes close to running in fitness levels, but I would wonder how well skiers adapt to running.

She may have been an exception, but Ingrid Kristiansen transitioned from cross country skiing to running quite nicely.