Marathon Strategy

[APM]

Good afternoon all;

after completing my first marathon last weekend in 3:42:17, I adopted a strategy of stopping on 10.5, 21 & 31.5k for 2 minutes to take on sports drink and some food. However, towards the end of each subsection I started to feel weak and my lower back really started to ache. I want to row another in another month or so, but was thinking of adopting a strategy of stopping every 8.5k for a minute and half.

I wanted to take the experiences of others on board as to what strategies worked for others and what the forum members would and would not recommend?

Regards,

[bepah]

My experience with stopping is that my musces stiffen up, my metabolism slows, and it is difficult to start up again. I gues the question is, why are you predetermining your rest stops? You will be in the same place no matter where you stop. My suggestion is to take you stops when you need them and make them as short a period as possible, even just slowing to an easy row pace and not ever coming to a stop at all. You might have a better recovery.

Good luck!

[Bob S.]

Good afternoon all;

after completing my first marathon last weekend in 3:42:17, I adopted a strategy of stopping on 10.5, 21 & 31.5k for 2 minutes to take on sports drink and some food. However, towards the end of each subsection I started to feel weak and my lower back really started to ache. I want to row another in another month or so, but was thinking of adopting a strategy of stopping every 8.5k for a minute and half.

I wanted to take the experiences of others on board as to what strategies worked for others and what the forum members would and would not recommend?

Regards,

My own strategy was to do a lot of long pieces, gradually increasing the time it get used to it. When it came time to do the my most recent FM, I was able to do it with only one break. The build up helped to develop tolerance for all the various problems that develop. My times have been in the 3:15:xx-3:22:xx range and my most recent HM was 1:37:51, with no breaks.

Bob S.

[carlb]

Search the web with Marathon rowing tips. This C2 AUS page has lots of good info
http://www.concept2.com.au/training/tra ... athon.aspx

And it has Eddie Fletcher's Marathon PDF which is a must read.
http://www.concept2.com.au/app_cmslib/m ... 0guide.pdf

Also see http://www.fletchersportscience.co.uk which I think has more info.

As I recall it's important not to get dehydrated by drinking every 15 minutes. Your first stop at 10k in would be at least 40 minutes so too long. I use a biking water bottle with a narrow at the neck that I can hold it on the drive (and the handle) then drink in the recovery. I'll take about 3 or 4 sips over 6 or 8 strokes. It's a pain, but needed.

I've done a half, I've never done a marathon....yet, maybe some day. The marathon seems too demanding on the body and I think I've seen suggestions for 6 weeks to fully recover.

[Cyclist2]

I've done only one marathon (on the erg). Bob's suggestion, and all those training plans' suggestions, of building up to it is critical. Compare it to running a marathon, or cycling a century (100 miles). No way could you just decide to go do it this Saturday, without paying a heavy price. Take a month or more to slowly increase your time on the erg. You'll find that eventually you'll be able to go the distance without stopping, but still be able to hydrate and fuel up (just slow down for a few strokes, but keep the wheel spinning). I may or may not ever do another one - I just didn't enjoy it. About the same experience as my two running marathons decades ago - I can say I've done it.

[APM]

Thanks a lot for your tips, and you have all given me some interesting perspectives on your outlook for this type of challenge. I think the overriding point is finding what works for you personally, and riding with that. I'll take some time in researching this more and learn the lessons from my last completion.

Thanks,

[Nosmo]

Years ago I was training for a full marathon on the erg (which I never ended up doing). Two things for drinking and eating worked well. One method was eating or drinking alternatively every 10 minutes. I had some clif bars open and broken in to pieces I could pick up and put in my mouth. I could very slowly chew and swallow them without slowing my pace at all. On alternate 10 minutes I would drink, by reaching for a wide mouth bottle filling my mouth and slowing drink it while breathing through my nose. Taking small swallows. If you are careless you may chock, but it works well without slowing down and you can eat little and very often. If you do this properly your muscles may be sore but you wouldn't be weak from dehydration or low blood sugar. The other method to drink involved hanging a camel above me. One can periodically reach for the cord and put it in your mouth and continue rowing and drinking. The temperature will make a huge difference in how often you need to drink.

That saidm something is wrong if you are getting week at the end of the first section. Rowing 10.5K or even 21K at full marathon pace should not leave you week from food. If it was hot then perhaps you were week from dehydration, if not you need to reevaluate your pre-race nutrition. Even so you should eat and drink regularly.

I have race two full marathons on the water. First time in a single I stopped about 5 times--but two of those were forced stops because of wakes. Second time in a double we stopped only twice--once was because of a wake. Did the entire second half with no stops. The person who has the course record in the single (3:01) said he did not stop at all. So it is possible not to stop much but training and pre race hydration and food makes a huge difference. On the erg it is easier to eat and drink then in a boat so no reason not to eat and drink often if you figure out how.

[gregsmith01748]

Your mileage may vary, but I took breaks at 12,22 and 32k to drink diluted Gatorade. I didn't eat during the row. The breaks were about 10", 30" and 30".

If you want to read the full account, i blogged about it here: http://concept2.co.uk/forum/blog.php?u=11746&b=83751

The other thing was to do a few long (100' and 120') rows to try to figure a pace that I could sustain with a reasonable heart rate

[GreenGA]

This subject is very interesting. I never thought to ask and I thank the OP...

In the past I have done a couple of dozen HM's; best time, nothing earth shattering, just under 93 minutes) and now after a hiatus, I am back to rowing and want to do a nonstop FM.

Towards that goal, I started training at multiple 5k rowing sessions, then 6k and am now up to 5 - 7k sessions with a 3 or 4 minute break between each session. During the break, I drink Gatorade, sometimes a little chocolate milk then get ready for the next session.

Once I hit 6 - 7k sessions, I will combine them into 3 - 14k sessions, then 2 - HM's and then prepare for the FM by working my way up from a HM, to, say 25 & 17, then 30 & 12, then 35 and 7 and finally the full 42k.. I never had any issues with hydration during the HM, but anything beyond that distance has me concerned.

The question is this... Since I also bike, I have a couple of Camelbak backpacks with the water bladders, and was thinking, perhaps.., I could fill one of the bladders with an "energy liquid" and sip the liquid during the row so I would not need to stop.

Since I only, within the past few minutes, because of this thread, thought of this idea, I have not tried it. Does anyone think it would work?

[Robt.Lee]

I've done a couple of marathons under 3 hours, one thing I learned was that good padding for the seat is critical, so is getting some protein along with the sports drinks. I have used the Hammer Perpetua, but there are lots of choices. Water along is not sufficient for me.

[Cyclist2]

I've only done one marathon (on the erg), and the few easy strokes it took to get a drink or a gel were insignificant in the overall time. I kept a slightly faster pace than my goal to allow for the few short "breaks" (I never stopped rowing, just rowed one-handed for the time it took to grab a bottle and take a swig). I had bottles on both sides so I could grab with either hand. As to your question, I would think that carrying the extra weight of the camelback back and forth for 3 hours would outweigh the benefits. It would cause you to sweat more, which might run down into your trou and possibly create problems down there. I say stick to grabbing strategically placed bottles, gels, bananas, whatever works for you.

[Carl Watts]

If its your first one I would recomend the following as it helped me for sure.

The first thing I did was look at the pace predictor and get it to workout at what my PB pace would be.

Set yourself a target pace from the start and a finish time as a goal.

The FM is a very different event as it starts out at what feels like a slow pace but you HR gradually climbs through all the zones. The aim for me was to just finish so I was going a bit slower than PB pace. Don't stop for breaks, this is a no no. It was bad enough that a courier knocked on my door and I had to run down the stairs and pickup a package. This cost me like 250m that I spent the next hour clawing back to catch up with the Guy I was rowing online with. The last hour was hell. Used a moisturiser in various places including under the arms to avoid chaffing and it paid off. No problems with the seat comfort, the standard seat is fine but if you have problems with the HM then you need to get this sorted.

Have bottles and bottles of chilled electrolytes at arms reach. You can never have enough and you don't want to run out. Was drinking a 750ml every hour but this was the bare minimum. Every muscle in both legs cramped after the finish so I was still not drinking enough.

It was mental as much as physical, you just tell yourself your not going to stop and take regular sips of fluid. It really helps if you have a support person available to talk to, hold out drinks and do silly things like pull the tops of the sipper bottle because it's darn hard to do this while still trying to row with one hand and the bottle jammed between your legs !

[GreenGA]

I never thought of it that way. Your points are valid and make sense.

I'll try it your way when I get to my HM's; probably next week or the follwing.

I've only done one marathon (on the erg), and the few easy strokes it took to get a drink or a gel were insignificant in the overall time. I kept a slightly faster pace than my goal to allow for the few short "breaks" (I never stopped rowing, just rowed one-handed for the time it took to grab a bottle and take a swig). I had bottles on both sides so I could grab with either hand. As to your question, I would think that carrying the extra weight of the camelback back and forth for 3 hours would outweigh the benefits. It would cause you to sweat more, which might run down into your trou and possibly create problems down there. I say stick to grabbing strategically placed bottles, gels, bananas, whatever works for you.