Ranger's training thread

[PaulH]

My first bit of race preparation will be a FM @ 1:48.

But, lordy, before I pull a 2K @ 1:34/6:16, I'll have to do at least ten or fifteen comparable 2K predictors--HM, 60min, 10K, 30min, 6K, 5K, 1K, 500m, 8 x 500m, 4 x 1K, 4 x 2K, etc.

No you won't - as you've said repeatedly, predictions line up exactly; if you can do a FM at a pace that predicts 6:16, you can also do a HM at a pace that predicts 6:16, and a 10K, and so on. So once you've done that FM you can move on to a month or so of sharpening (which, as you've also repeated endlessly, everyone does in about the same way with about the same effect, even though you've never managed it with anything like your new stroke) and then do 6:16 for 2K. Given that you have the fitness, and the stroke, and have done millions of meters with that stroke, I don't see why you couldn't do the FM this weekend, which means we should see the 6:16 by the end of July at the latest.

[ausrwr]

It's all moot though, isn't it Rich.

What you "could" do...

Well, you won't.

You won't pull a 1:48 FM, as the latest evidence to hand states that you can't even pull a 1:45 2k.

You won't race HOCR, as the latest evidence states that you can't steer or stay in a boat.

You're a shadow of the athlete who was once good, but has struggled to make weight and has only recently performed in venues where weigh-in procedure has been dubious at best.

You've dug yourself deep into a hole, and you're not smart enough to admit it, ask for help, or even re-think your plans, let alone your unrealistic goals.

[Carl Watts]

Rich, use the pace predictor. Your FM pace is slower than mine at 2:06.9 because I'm now faster than you at every distance you care to name. If you actually bothered to do some racing at the various distances you would find the results line up with great accuracy.

You cannot even row a 5K at 1:48 pace, Mike threw down that challenge months ago and you never delivered with an IND_V.

Basically we are going round a round with this thread and going nowhere fast, a bit like you OTW.

[ranger]

This seems to be the major difficulty with training for rowing:

Everyone who except those who are already the best settle for rowing badly--and that's the end of it.

If you row badly in training, you can only train yourself to race badly.

ranger

[ranger]

You cannot even row a 5K at 1:48 pace

But the issue for my training, Carl, and Mike's, is not doing a 5K trial, 1:48 @ AT, but a 5K paddle, 1:48 @ UT2.

At UT2, you do 5K at 2:03.

At UT2, Mike does 5K at something similar.

Why?

ranger

[ginster]

You cannot even row a 5K at 1:48 pace

But the issue for my training, Carl, and Mike's, is not doing a 5K trial, 1:48 @ AT, but a 5K paddle, 1:48 @ UT2.

At UT2, you do 5K at 2:03.

At UT2, Mike does 5K at something similar.

Why?

ranger

you're missing the point - again - your problem is that you can't do 5k @1:48 in any training band...

[ranger]

Yea.

I've _really_ got it going now, 1:44 @ 26 spm (12 SPI).

Middlin' UT1 HR (155 bpm), steady state.

So, if I can rate 26 spm for a FM, and I think I can, while it is pretty amazing to think so, I might indeed pull 1:44 for a FM and challenge the Open hwt FM WR.

1:44 for a FM would be under Matthias' Open lwt FM WR by two seconds per 500m.

Matthias, the 40s lwt 2K WR holder, just pulled 6:17 for 2K.

1:44 for a FM predicts a 6:00 2K.

A FM is done at 2K + 14.

If I can pull a FM @ 1:44 at 60, it will be a nice, round 10 seconds per 500m better than I could do 10 years ago.

My FM pb is 1:54/2:40.

So, by working on technique and stroking power rather than fitness, over the last decade, I will have gained a second per 500m per year, despite aging 10 years.

The normal decline with age from 50 to 60 is four seconds per 500m.

So the overall gain will have been 14 seconds per 500m, which is pretty much the entire gap between the best 60s rowers and the best young rowers in the world, of whatever age--like this guy:



ranger

[JimR]

Your claims of 1:46 FM are just talk rich, that's all. You have never once provided anything to backup your claims that you are even remotely close to it.

Over the last eight years, I have answered this challenge.

I think this statement is untrue ... absolutly untrue.

The discussion for the past 8 years has been you doing a 1:48 FM ... as a prelude to a 6:16 2K. Neither has been done. You have been challenged to show you could do either and have failed every time. You have claimed you would do these, could do these ... and yet it has not happened.

In fact ... on the 1:48 FM ... not only can't you do it but you refuse to even try.

So there it is ... ranger ... all talk.

JimR

[JimR]

So, if ...

... Matthias ...

It appears you are moving on to Matthias now ... because he is the most recent person to actually do what you claim you can do.

I feel sorry for Matthias because I'm sure you will share your opinions on why he is not good ... or won't be good in 20 years ... etc.

As soon as you realize the reall issue is you and what you claim you can do but aren't able to do this will all make sense. I suspect that nt having a job is making this worse, as you have to much free time to ponder your problem.

You should have done the 1:48 FM before claiming you could do it.

JimR

[Carl Watts]

You cannot even row a 5K at 1:48 pace

But the issue for my training, Carl, and Mike's, is not doing a 5K trial, 1:48 @ AT, but a 5K paddle, 1:48 @ UT2.

At UT2, you do 5K at 2:03.

At UT2, Mike does 5K at something similar.

Why?

ranger

No I do 10K at middle UT2 146HR ave. 2:02.5 pace only R17 but let's not split hairs.That's exactly the numbers I predicted before my last training row and exactly the numbers I ended up with at the finish. Feels good to be honest about your ability and to know what your actually capable of, you should try it. Mikes a better rower than the both of us, I have no problem with that, do you ?

Oh now it's a FM at 1:44 pace because your not getting enough attention ? your sick......seek help ASAP.

[ben990]

I sure do hope that this will work on ranger...

[ranger]

The main problem at the moment with my rowing at 26 spm and 120 df. is how _slow_ it is.

The ratio is pretty much 4-to-1.

.5 seconds for the drive.

2 seconds for the recovery.

That's a _huge_ ratio.

In a 4-to-1 ratio, you spend so much time on the recovery that it is ridiculous.

With my quick finishes and recoveries and therefore quick return to prep position, I have to force myself to _wait_ at the catch to keep the rate down.

If I don't pay explicit attention to it, the rate keeps ballooning up to 27 spm, 28 spm, 29 spm, etc.

I am now getting this under control, though.

ranger

[ranger]

It is a nice accident, I think, that the 60s lwt American record is 1:44/6:56.

A FM is done at 2K + 14.

I am a 60s lwt.

ranger

[JimR]

I am a 60s lwt

Half right as usual

JimR

[atklein90]

The main problem at the moment with my rowing at 26 spm and 120 df. is how _slow_ it is.

The ratio is pretty much 4-to-1.

.5 seconds for the drive.

2 seconds for the recovery.

That's a _huge_ ratio.

ranger

I think I just figured out why Ranger thinks he's so fast!

Based on the commentary above, Ranger's 'minutes' are 65 seconds long. (2.5seconds per stroke, 26 SPM = 65 seconds.)

Ranger, unfortunately, in the real world, minutes are only 60 seconds. But in Rangerland, 1:52.5pace is actually 1:44 pace.....interesting.