The Rerow Function: A Benefit or Hindrance?

[Deewen]

Hi everyone, I'm new to the forum and wondered what the general feeling is about the rerow function. I rediscovered rowing in Oct 2008 and always used the rerow function on my hard workouts, however, I've recently changed my mind. Funnily enough it was due to an error on my logcard. I couldn't see all of my data and therefore didn't have access to my previous workout info. There was a lag time of about a week, until I got hold of a USB cable so that I could download the logcard utility program, and within this time I decided to just do my workouts with planned times written on a note above my rowing machine. It all went so well, that I have decided not to use the rerow function and here is why:

1. I realized that I had become a slave to the pace boat and not focused on pacing myself, based on my workout plan. I realized that I had become lazy and allowed the pace boat to determine and dominate the workout.

2. When in less than optimal form, the pace boat is not a motivator. As a result of not using rerow, I do my workouts based on how I feel for the current workout and not on how I felt the previous week. It's hard to do that when you are afraid of the pace boat "winning", even though that pace boat is "you".

3. I have become much better at planning my workouts ahead of time, like how many seconds faster I'm going to row and when, instead of just focusing on "beating my previous time".

4. I get a better feel for my speed and how I pace myself, because I focus on the stroke times as oppose to the object at the bottom of my screen.

So, not using rerow is making me a better rower.

Any thoughts?

Hope I was clear. The clocks went forward over the weekend, so I'm still a bit fuzzy! Luckily, Mondays are easy rowing days for me ) Yawn...

Deborah

[djh]

I find re-row useful when I'm trying to beat a tough PB. The pace boat lets me concentrate on the essence. I like all the little dancing numbers on my monitor, but sometimes I just want something simple.

[Bob S.]

I suppose that using it all the time is not that great an idea. I have been using C2 indoor rowers for over 15 years and had never tried out the rerow feature until just a few weeks ago. (My old model B with a PM1 didn't even have it, but I have had the use of PM3s for several years now.) It was both fun and useful, but I didn't feel that I had any need to use it on a regular basis, just for special purposes once in a while.

Bob S.

[Deewen]

It may well be that rerow was primarily created for people who lack motivation and thus need a visual mark in order to make their workouts more meaningful. It certainly has a good use when all you want to do is beat your best time without having to look at the countdown.

[Montanaandy]

Well Deewen, I guess that I lack motivation because I use it pretty much each time I row (unless I am traveling) I guess that this would also apply to those who use Row Pro because that program certainly provides a visual cue.

I like to use the re-row of my PB or one of my better times so that I will not slack off too much and will at least be within a few seconds or so of the PB. When I start to fall behind the pace boat I tend to try to pick it up a bit.

I honestly don't pay too much attention to the pace boat or music while I am rowing. I usually am going over cases or arguments, etc. and come up with some of my best ideas while rowing (must be the blood flow).

The problem that I have with the re-row is accuracy. I have found that if I drop behind by a second or two (say I take stop rowing to take a shot of water a few times during a longer row) I often can't catch up even though the monitor says that I am rowing faster than the rate of the pace boat. Ditto for if I am ahead of the pace boat and I slack off - the pace boat does not catch up to me despite my slowing my pace considerably.

[Deewen]

"Well Deewen, I guess that I lack motivation because I use it pretty much each time I row (unless I am traveling) Smile I guess that this would also apply to those who use Row Pro because that program certainly provides a visual cue. "

I certainly see why it was created, and it is probably is a good motivator for a lot of people. Have you ever discovered that you don't want to go as fast as the pace boat after all, during a workout? My problem is that it's hard to just let the pace boat go past me, so it hasn't happened yet - I just can't let it happen ) which has resulted in me overdoing it in a few workouts. So for me, rerow is a bad motivator. If I plan my workouts manually, then I can do better if all goes well, or take it easy, if I feel that I would ruin the rest of my training week by overdoing it in one particular session.

I haven't experienced what you described about the pace boat not being accurate. That might be something to mention to the tech crew at Concept 2, especially if you use the pace boat for every workout.

[Deewen]

Just an afterthought...

This is Digital Rowing's intro for their software RowPro, so I guess their selling point is that the visual aspect motivates those who would otherwise find it hard to continue training.

"90% of rowers say finding the time and motivation to row are the most critical factors. That's where RowPro helps. When you install RowPro in your PC and connect it to your Concept2 Indoor Rower you open up many new possibilities:"

Whatever works I guess. The most important thing is to train, whether you need an external motivator or not.

[Montanaandy]

Deewen - I don't know how long you have been rowing or what type of pieces you normally row (i.e. shorter or longer) but I personally have found after 20+ years of using the C2 on a regular basis (daily during the week) and rowing longer pieces as my body has aged (9K - 12K) that I need to find something to keep me going/interested. This is particularly true when I hit Thu. or Fri. and I am somewhat tired from work, kids, etc. Again, no lack of motivation just the recognition that rowing is not the #1 thing in my life but is something that I do to stay in shape and which I do enjoy, somedays more than other days.

[Deewen]

Hi Montanaandy,

I rowed a few years ago, but was preoccupied with other forms of training, so I dropped it. I rediscovered rowing in October of 2008. I train 3 times a week. I have two children ( 4 1/2 and 7 years old), so my time is limited to train (I get up at 6am, before the rest of the family is awake to train). However, when I train, I'm motivated and make the most out of it. I'm just that way. When I'm focused on something, then I'm totally focused. Which has a lot to do with why I'm also a stay at home mum. I can't focus on my kids and work 9-5, etc. - but that's another discussion.

Rowing certainly isn't the # 1 thing in my life either, however for the 30 minutes, 3 times a week I can do it, I'm highly motivated. This is not in any way to knock people who have a different motivation level. Not at all. I've always liked training and so my motivation is already there. Everyone is different. As I said, the important thing is to train. How everyone gets it done is up to the individual.

Deborah

[Montanaandy]

Deewen:

I understanding where you are coming from in terms of time constraints (lawyer married to a lawyer at the tail end of raising 3 kids now 21 year old, 19 year old, 14 years old and we both worked full time). I also understand focus and goals (college hockey player who completed US undergraduate and law/doctorate degrees in 7 straight years then went to work).

I personally believe that everyone who rows on a regular and consistent basis day after day, week after week, year after year is highly motivated so I don't feel that "motivation" is involved here. I believe that if you stick with the rowing for years you will begin to look for ways to keep rowing interesting when it becomes rather mundane or routine.

You cite in your post that you are a relative newcomer to rowing after dabbling in it prior to Oct. 2008 but that you now put in 3 x 30 min each week. Let's renew this discussion one year from now as you continue to vary/increase your training and see where you are at with rowing in terms of your training and your motivation.

[Deewen]

Montanaandy:

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said, "Let's renew this discussion one year from now as you continue to vary/increase your training and see where you are at with rowing in terms of your training and your motivation."

I think this is where it lies, variation. Since Oct 2008, I've already changed my routine a couple of times, and will probably change it a few more times before we revisit this discussion a year from now. My routine changes based on my overall goal, how effective I want my training, time constraints, etc. A routine that changes now and then doesn't face the boredom factor that other routines have and that also has a positive effect on motivation.

Don't get me wrong, I don't change my routine, just for the sake of it, however, I find that I'm always willing to fine tune it, when needed. For example: 2 of my workouts are constant whereas the 3rd one is varied, based on a 6 week rotation. Therefore I only repeat one type of intense exercise once every 6 weeks. So instead of dreading "another fitness test or interval ,etc.", like some people do, I get excited as the week for it gets closer. It's also wonderful to see significant gains when I've finished the workout, which is a big motivator and gets me excited for the next time. When the workout is hard, my motivation is, "I won't do this again until 6 weeks from now, so I'd better make the best of it." I give a lot, but leave a little bit for the next time. Meaning, I don't go ALL OUT, until I have nothing left, because how can I top that, mentally? If I leave a little bit, then I have something to build on for the next workout.

I may be fairly new to rowing, but I've trained for a long time and this approach works very well. It's why I've been able to train for over a decade without losing motivation. My main problem actually was balancing diet and training. It was very frustrating. I was "fit fat" for the longest time LOLOLO. I couldn't seem to tweak my diet to suit my training. However, about two years ago, I finally found the right food for my body. Now my body reflects my training efforts - finally!

As for your time constraint - phew! Those must have been some pretty intense years, especially the toddler years! It's only in the last year or so that I have been able to have more control over when I train, since the girls are out of the toddler stage. It wasn't that long ago that I had to wait until 9:30pm to do my interval sprints on my treadmill, after the girls were tucked in bed and fast asleep. Still, I appreciated the workouts all the more, because then it was exclusively "my time" after a busy day. "Good times", but I'm happy they are in the past LOLOLO

Deborah

[vigtoire]

I've been, following this thread was interest. I have been using the Rerow function in my buildup to the London marathon next week. I have been using my rower for cross-training only for this purpose and found the Rerow function was constantly pushing me and improving my times. Last night I did my final 10K on the rower before the marathon WITHOUT the Rerow function and got my PB! I was only out to go for a very relaxed, strong last session before a few short runs this week and just wanted to keep it steady. I found my mind was free though and was enjoying the row for what it was.
I will still use the Rerow function in the future, but obviously it is very physcological...

[Deewen]

Last night I did my final 10K on the rower before the marathon WITHOUT the Rerow function and got my PB!

Hi Vigtoire:
I think I allowed Rerow to give me the illusion of motivation via its visual marker, and almost got myself into the habit of thinking that I needed it to do a PB. I haven't used rerow for the last 3 weeks or so and have been able to do just as expected/desired in my hard workouts. I guess I no longer use the clock for the same reason. I don't like to think I'm giving it all, just to beat the clock. I like my workouts to be strategic. A few of my workouts don't turn out as planned, but that's usually due to tiredness (for one reason or another) and no pace boat or clock is going to drive me harder when my body is strongly advising against it.

So I guess, my point is: For me, planning a workout ahead of time, seems more effective than just chasing a pace boat. I've found that I've improved on pacing myself during the workout and get a lot more information and lessons out of the workout, than I did with a rerow session.

I found my mind was free though and was enjoying the row for what it was.

This I totally relate to. Without the focus on the pace boat, I'm able to enjoy the workout more. I can back off when I need to, then charge on, when my energy comes back. I have control of my workout. When I used rerow, I felt like the pace boat had control and my only aim was to beat it. My workouts have to be more than beating the pace boat. Not every workout should be an attempt to beat a PB, in my opinion. For me, selecting rerow just sends me on a one way journey.

Sometimes I don't know that I don't have the energy for a hard workout until after I've started. It's happened recently. I was supposed to do a hard 5000m and improve my time. After the first 500m I knew that there was something wrong. If I had used the pace boat it would have been a big disappointment, seeing the pace boat go by. However, since I was doing it "free style", I just rowed hard for the first 1000m then changed it into a medium workout instead. I'm due for another attempt to better my PB in a couple of weeks and my motivation in tact.

Deborah

[Deewen]

Deewen:

I understanding where you are coming from in terms of time constraints (lawyer married to a lawyer at the tail end of raising 3 kids now 21 year old, 19 year old, 14 years old and we both worked full time). I also understand focus and goals (college hockey player who completed US undergraduate and law/doctorate degrees in 7 straight years then went to work).

I personally believe that everyone who rows on a regular and consistent basis day after day, week after week, year after year is highly motivated so I don't feel that "motivation" is involved here. I believe that if you stick with the rowing for years you will begin to look for ways to keep rowing interesting when it becomes rather mundane or routine.

You cite in your post that you are a relative newcomer to rowing after dabbling in it prior to Oct. 2008 but that you now put in 3 x 30 min each week. Let's renew this discussion one year from now as you continue to vary/increase your training and see where you are at with rowing in terms of your training and your motivation.

Hey Montanaandy, remember me?

I don't think I'll ever be accused of having a bad memory! Here we are, roughly a year later after we had this conversation

I'm still rowing 3 times a week, but the times now vary. I've recently started doing 60min sessions on Sunday, instead of my regular 30min@20spm session. My motivation is still in full swing. In terms of training, my progress, so far, is listed below.

About 6-7 weeks ago, I shovelled some heavy snow the day after a rowing session and experienced some pain in my shoulder. So when I did my next workout I subconsciously tried to protect my shoulder and ended up overcompensating and straining a back muscle (I've had no problems with my shoulder since then). The muscle went from hurting and being quite stiff, to feeling a bit tight and that's where it is today. I'm still able to do my weekly workouts but don't plan to do any sprinting until I can't feel any tightness at all. I've made an appointment at the doctor's to get it checked out. The muscle gives me no trouble at all, but there is still a slight tightness that shouldn't be there, so I think it's best to have someone look at it. I did a 4x6min (with 1 min rest) this morning and went as fast as 2:09.3 on the last interval without any problems.

2k
1 may 2009 8:29.8--2:07.4@25
22 Jan 2010 8:18.4--2:04.6@24

5k
8 May 2009 22:09.2--2:12.9@?
23 Oct 2009 21:32.3--2:09.2@23

6k
26 June 2009 27:05.8--2:15.4@23
30 Oct 2009 26:12.2--2:11.0@23

30min
14 June 2009 6564--2:17.1@23
2 Oct 2010 6858--2:11.2@24

10k
9 Oct 2009 44:58.0--2:14.9@22
9 Apr 2010 44:42.1--2:14.1@21

HM (21097m)
11 Dec 2009 1:39:46.1--2:21.8@21

So how are things going with you?

Regards, Deborah

[Montanaandy]

Hey Deborah:

Things are going well. Still putting in my 35-40K meters each week over 4 sessions. Continuously trying to devise ways to keep things "fresh" on the erg after all of these years. Doing more interval work that I have in the past. Not concerned with my times although I do not like to row too far off my standard pace on a given piece. I am focused on completing the piece and getting a good workout. If I have a good time, great, if I don't, oh well.

Sorry to hear about your injury. I too have battled through periodic illness/injury this past year as I normally do but I just keep rowing (much more slowly when I am recovering). Again, after 20+ years on this machine I have developed a feel for what I can and cannot (should not) do at certain times.

Still using the re-row function and hoping that I can eventually hook up my Mac and get Row Pro to work with it on my Windows boot (think that there is a glitch with my PM3 because I have tried everything to get it to work to no avail). May purchase a netbook just to hook it up to the Erg or I may upgrade to a PM4.

Continued happy rowing. Montanaandy

Still enjoy having the opponents boat on the screen and "competing" against it in the later stages of my piece. Realize that (at least on my erg) once I get a bit behind there is no way that I will catch up (the opposite also holds true - if I come out hard in the beginning of a piece and establish a bit of distance then the computer will not catch up even if I slack off/slow down considerably). Even knowing this my competitive instincts push me to empty the tank at the end in an attempt to at least narrow the gap.