Drills to combat bum shoving?

[azuroff]

After reading several other threads, I'm pretty sure I'm suffering from bum shoving - as I pull back, I really don't feel any resistance until my arms start pulling back. Basically, it doesn't feel like my legs are doing any work at all.

Are there drills that I can do to improve this? I just started rowing within the last week, and I'd really like to get my technique right before I learn a bunch of bad habits that need to be unlearned later.

[Citroen]

Watch this http://concept2.co.uk/training/faults_corrections_video

[Byron Drachman]

A "catch drill" might help. You keep the forward lean and keep the arms straight and drive with the legs.

You could tie a string from the handle to the seat to make sure the handle and seat are moving at the same speed during the first part of the drive.

[NavigationHazard]

Byron's suggestion is very good. Here's a link to an old issue of Rowing News in which Tom Bohrer discusses what he calls the "strap drill" in detail:

Tom Bohrer article

[bloomp]

I'm gonna add another suggestion to the three great ideas already presented.

Start with rowing arms only, then add in back, then row at half slide. Most of the problem with shooting the slide (bum shoving) comes from going to half slide to full slide. So row for 2-3 minutes only using half the slide. Then think about transitioning completely up to the catch but keeping your hands and butt at the same relative position during the drive/recovery as they were on the 'mini-stroke' you had just been doing.

[azuroff]

Ok, for warm-up tonight, I started with arms-only for 2 minutes, then arms and back for 2 minutes, and finally legs-only. During the intervals themselves, I was really focused on NOT bum-shoving, and I think I did better. I do have some other questions, though -

The only time I feel resistance on the chain from the very beginning is on the very first stroke - when the flywheel is completely stopped. Other than that, it feels I move the handle back 2 or 3 inches before I feel any resistance at all - is that normal?

If I'm pushing back correctly with my legs, should it feel like they're "exploding" out of the catch? I focused on doing that during the last interval, and I was definitely feeling resistance sooner in the stroke than before.

[azuroff]

One more question - is 22 spm too fast for a complete out-of-shape noob? That's what I've been averaging so far.

[Citroen]

One more question - is 22 spm too fast for a complete out-of-shape noob? That's what I've been averaging so far.

Just about ideal.

Most new rowers I see in the gym are doing short strokes at 32spm like a Duracell bunny taking amphetamines.

[hjs]

Ok, for warm-up tonight, I started with arms-only for 2 minutes, then arms and back for 2 minutes, and finally legs-only. During the intervals themselves, I was really focused on NOT bum-shoving, and I think I did better. I do have some other questions, though -

The only time I feel resistance on the chain from the very beginning is on the very first stroke - when the flywheel is completely stopped. Other than that, it feels I move the handle back 2 or 3 inches before I feel any resistance at all - is that normal?

If I'm pushing back correctly with my legs, should it feel like they're "exploding" out of the catch? I focused on doing that during the last interval, and I was definitely feeling resistance sooner in the stroke than before.

When you begin the stroke, you have to "catch" the flywheel, that is spinning and you only feel resistance if you excellerate the flywheel, you proberbly need that first 2/3 inches to get enough speed in your stroke to catch the flywheel.
And yes you have to start the stroke fast, with the legs that is, certainly not the arms, they have to come last and also not the back, that comes half way.
The point is, rowing is not a continues movement, like for instance cycling, you have to accelerate the flywheel during the hole drive, if not you just go back and forth.

Rate 22 is fine to start off with, don,t focus to much on rating at first, try to get a smooth relative strong stroke first.

[milkman21]

A few things come to mind:

(1) close-quarters combat training for preventing the initial take down
(2) Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu for a last chance reversal if you're already pinned.
(3) squats and deadlifts for creating strong glutes as a barrier (if 1 and 2 fail)

Stay strong!

[Den-J]

Sometimes just a new point of view can help, my son started rowing a month ago and just could not get the drive right off hand I said dont think of pushing with your legs think of getting your knees down fast instead ..that seemed to make the difference once you feel the drive its like a revelation it just feels right. if you lift your heels you could also try dropping your heels really quickly that lets you feel the drive more as well (but dont make a habit of it just use it to get a feel of the resistance from a good drive as i'm sure dropping your heels like that over a long time would injure you) for what its worth my son has gone from 2:20 pace the first couple of tries to a 39:42 10k

[azuroff]

When you begin the stroke, you have to "catch" the flywheel, that is spinning and you only feel resistance if you excellerate the flywheel

So, if I understand that correctly, you don't feel any resistance until the chain is traveling faster than the flywheel, then?

[hjs]

When you begin the stroke, you have to "catch" the flywheel, that is spinning and you only feel resistance if you excellerate the flywheel

So, if I understand that correctly, you don't feel any resistance until the chain is traveling faster than the flywheel, then?

Yes, that's also why newbies often set the damper high, this slows the fan/flywheel down more, so it's easier to catch fan. That's wrong, the stroke is simply not good.

[jrockfitch]

I asked my wife about this, and she said "pepper spray".