New Wolverine Plan Thread

[Yankeerunner]

Does anyone have any experience following the WP while erging on slides? I use slides to reduce the strain on my lower back. I notice that low stroke rates are harder to maintain when I'm on slides. (By the way I'm just learning about the WP system, prompted by reading the interview on Row2k.)

I did the WP while using slides and didn't have any problem. It just takes a bit of practice. Without really trying I eventually found myself occasionally doing 14spm during cooldowns once I got used to the 16spm of L4s.


Nosmo, thanks for posting the link. Great article. Good to see 'The Man' going strong and looking good.

[MateosDad]

You're right, Yankeerunner - it does take practice to maintain the low ratings in L4 workouts with slides (in addition to a coreperform seat...). But it is worth it. It requires focus. I'm still investigating the wp - can we say KoolAid here?...

[WisconsinRower]

Hi all. New to the forum. I have been rowing for about 3 months now, and have been working my way thru the Pete's Plan for beginners while reading and absorbing the WP. I have tried a few L4 rows, and enjoy them, but have a problem. How do you keep track of what segment you are currently working on? I use the spreadsheet posted further up in this thread to generate the workout, and print it out. I then write the times when the segments change on the printout and post it next to my machine. Trying to read it while rowing, while concentrating on rate and pace is difficult. Not impossible but not ideal. Is there a better way to do this? I assume it will get easier with repetition, but how much easier?

edit: If I construct a workout using all 2 min. segments it is not to bad, all the changes come on even numbers, but as soon as I mix in a 4,3,2,1 segment, that goes out the window.

[Nosmo]

One fairly quickly learns what the sequences are so one just has to have written down the workout: something like 180, 184, 188, 184, 188.

When I started I put the ratings and pace on a piece of tape on the machine. Then I did the same for each workout. After a while I just need the sequences. I prefer to to write the workout on masking tape and put that on the machine so it is always directly in front of me.

[pmacaula]

Having followed the WP for the past few months as faithfully as other commitments in life permit, I set a PB in a 2K race on Sunday. Very happy with the result.

This was my big and only planned race, but I had so much fun, I'm thinking of going to another one in a month. Would prefer to make slow progress & not go into maintenance or off-season mode quite yet.

Have been using a Ref pace of 1:42, based on a 2K time of 6:49.6 set back in October. My race time was 6:39.6, which would suggest a Ref Pace of 1:40.

Switching Ref Pace seems to be a no-no for an experienced racer, but I recall comments in some of the old WP documents & threads about making adjustments for novices, which I am pretty sure applys to me.

Any thoughts on whether to adjust from a 1:42 Ref to a 1:40 ?
If yes, any ideas on how best to do so ?

The L1/L2/L3 workouts seem to take care of themselves, but for L4s, I am just now hitting 19.5spm avg rate & am apprehensive about adjusting rate if I move the pace up 2s/500.

Easy out is to leave everything as is. Just not sure if that is the right move.

Guidance/input appreciated.

Cheers. Patrick.

[Nosmo]

Hi Patrick,
Started a reply to your PM but didn't finish it yet. Am off at another computer doing something else and saw this.

Great row yesterday. Beautifully executed plan. MC would be very pleased.

Since you are not yet above 20 spm the easiest thing to do would be to leave the pace alone so you can finish out the season with it as it is.
However, I don't see much harm in decreasing the reference pace as long as you do it intelligently.

Decrease the patterns so you go a bit less distance. You would be doing slightly less distance in the same time with a bit more force at a given stroke rating so that would not likely be much of a problem. You could do a week at a 1:41 before dropping to 1:40. I'd say go for it.

edits follow:
Thinking a bit more: going to 1:40 is a 2% increase in speed or a 6% change in power. That is the same as increasing the rating by 1 spm in a L4 workout. So you want to drop your average rating to 18.5 from 19.5. But again I'd error on the side on of caution and either drop it a bit more or decrease the time for the first week.

[Mike Caviston]

Patrick,

My advice would depend on how serious you plan to take the race coming up in a month. If you are hoping to give your best performance, I’d keep the 1:42 Ref Pace and just progressively build towards an avg. of 20spm. Tweaking the force required per stroke may do more harm than good at this point. If, however, you are taking a longer view (next season) then now is probably a good time to change your Ref Pace. I’d go in stages, starting with a 1:41 Ref Pace with an avg. stroke rate in the low 18s. Once you feel comfortable, you can build progressively and depending on how well you adjust, maybe accelerate the process a little. If you get beyond 19spm @ 1:41 you can assess whether or not a 1:40 pace would be “doable”. All this will of course take more than a month to complete. If you do eventually switch to a 1:40 Ref Pace, build nice and slow from the beginning. Good luck, and report the results.
Edited with correct Ref Pace. Who came up with this incomprehensible system, anyway?

[pmacaula]

Mike & Nosmo,
Thanks very much for the thoughtful replies.

While taking the long view somehow sounds more wise, if I race next month, I would want to take it seriously. The definition of which would be to take a real shot at catching one of the guys who finished ahead of me yesterday.

The gaps to the next two racers are 4.1 and 12.3s respectively. Checked up on last year's results & both of them raced both yesterday's and next month's regattas. Assuming they will also improve, catching anyone is one tall order.

Given that, makes sense to minimize any messing about with the L4 Ref Pace & focus on the L1 & L2 work that I love to hate.

First order of business is to confirm with SWMBO that I can take another Sunday for an erg regatta. I sold the last one by getting our 9 & 6 year old boys wound up about competing in the kiddie races. Gotta work on an angle for this one, as there are no kiddie races this time.

Will report on the results, whether they involve a real race or a 'Basement Regatta' on or about the same date.

Cheers. Patrick.

[excellence]

Hi Patrick,

Thanx for the info. Ironically, I’ve just recently started doing the WP, and I love it. Tried the Pete Plan for a few, and at the end of the day, I mix it up anyway. Prior to Nov.-Dec. 08 I was only doing mid to long pieces (5-15k), and had only rowed alone, as my gym has 1 model C in poor shape. I got to spend some time doing some power rowing with some heavy hitters (both erg and water), and quickly acclimated to the cadence and synchronicity. I certified with IRTCI in December and between the instructors from the power classes and my master instructor from the certification, they all encouraged me to start training for Crash-b’s. I know of them, and I’ve watched a lot of tapes of them, but had never played with the distance. Since December I’ve pressed hard with short pieces, and my 500m is at 2:01; my 2k at 9’ (still not steady, a few secs. under or over). I haven’t figured out how to pace myself properly yet. I’ve had a few bad “fly and die” sessions. So anyone with any advice on how to pace myself – I’d appreciate it. I know negative splits are good, but I can’t get my bearings yet. I’ve watched some of the Crash-b’s thru the pace boats, and they hold those splits all the way thru.
I know that this would be an optimal performance, but given that I’ve been doing this for 1.5 months, what’s the best way to find my pacing?
Also, Level 4 is my favorite at this point, perhaps because I’ve spent so much time doing long pieces that I’m more tolerant to them. Thing is, I can’t seem to hit 16spm. 17-18spm, barely. I’ve made 3 different forms that I’m playing with that I put on the monitor, where I can better concentrate on the stroke instead of the timing, but I’m having a time with the lower #’s. The pace isn’t as hard, except in trying to find the middle ground. Today I did 60’. Last 2 were 40’s.

This is a much needed thread. I have the 16pg. Remarks by Mike Caisson, and was about to look up more data from him, so the info and links provided here are greatly appreciated. Most of my Concept 2 ranking times are in the 35 – 50%, and that’s considering that I just put them on line in November. So basically, the only one’s that are out and out race scores are the 500m, 2000k, and 5000k. All the others are what I’ve done so far, but not my PB. I hope someone can give me some advice. Thanx. By the by, I am a 50 y.o. female in good physical condition, who works out regularly.

[pmacaula]

I’ve just recently started doing the WP, and I love it.

Ex - you are not the only one. I just started the WP in mid Sept '08 & quite like it also.

I certified with IRTCI in December...

You are one diligent person. Makes sense you like the WP.

I haven’t figured out how to pace myself properly yet. I’ve had a few bad “fly and die” sessions. So anyone with any advice on how to pace myself...I know negative splits are good, but I can’t get my bearings yet...given that I’ve been doing this for 1.5 months, what’s the best way to find my pacing?

Though it is not an exact science, you might try using 'Paul's Law' (double the distance => add 5s/500m) for your next 2K. If your best 500m is 2:01, try the 2K at an avg of 2:11. Start out at 2:11 & see if you can hold it all the way through - looks like it would be a PB by quite a margin.
Alternatively, you could try the negative split approach to hit the same average - 800m@2:12; 600m@2:11;400m@2:10;200m@2:09(or as fast as you can).
If you can go faster, go for it. If it is too hard, try again at a slightly slower pace.

Also, Level 4 is my favorite...I can’t seem to hit 16spm. 17-18spm, barely.

I also had a tough time at the beginning, but can now go down to 14 without trouble. The lower stroke rates come with practice. Someone on the UK forum suggested a nifty approach - count one one the drive and 2,3,4 on the recovery. That should get you pretty close.

We are all finding our way. Welcome to the club !

Cheers. Patrick.

[Snail Space]

176,178,180,176,178,180 = 17.8av spm - 13722m target - 13794m actual = +0.52% (ref pace 1:48)

Wow, I enjoyed that session, although I found it mentally challenging. I had done 60' @2:02.9 (22spm) yesterday, but found today's session more challenging. I think that it is the discipline needed to hit rate and pace for each segment that is both difficult and also very rewarding if you can stick with it.

The average SPM for the 3rd and 4th segments was 19, and the distance was about 1% over target for each, so 'll have to work on that. Otherwise I kept to SPM fairly well and my distances for the other segments were within 0.10-0.15% of the targets.

I'm hoping to be a regular visitor on this thread now as the precision of the WP seems to suit my slightly geeky tendencies when planning things!

Cheers
Dave

[pmacaula]

...it is the discipline needed to hit rate and pace for each segment that is both difficult and also very rewarding if you can stick with it...I kept to SPM fairly well and my distances for the other segments were within 0.10-0.15% of the targets.

Dave - nice job on the 60' L4 session. Agree with you on the discipline being both a challenge and a reward. After doing L4s for a while, you will develop a very good 'feel' for what is sustainable, even at much higher intensities. It is something I have only come to appreciate since racing a 2K following a structured plan. It just felt right all the way through.

Cheers. Patrick.

[pmacaula]

Unintentionally (re-)proved the wisdom of alternating hard & recovery days and why L4 sessions should not be too hard.

Normal Schedule
Wednesday- L4 - long (2x40') or interval (7x'6 or 4x10')
Thursday - L3

Just for interest's sake, I printed up two versions of Wednesday's 2x40' L4 workout sheet (taped to the erg for reference during the session). One using my normal Ref Pace (1:42) and one with a 1:39 Ref Pace.
Sequences: 180/192/210/216 (6'Recovery) 194/196/212/184 (Avg 19.8spm)

Despite very good advice to the contrary (which I had followed to date), I gave in to temptation & tried out the 1:39-based pace.

At the end of 40', I felt ok, though definitely more tired than a normal session. Active recovery for the full 6'. For the 2nd 40', I backed off the targets by 1" on each of the paces (effectively using 1:40 Ref Pace). Completed successfully on rate & pace, but felt a LOT more drained than I had with any L4 before.

Definitely not a recovery row. Using RowPro stroke file data, determined that I had backed into a half marathon in about 82'45".

Paid the price on Thursday. Decided to bag my planned L3 & join the 7pmET RowPro crew for their 4x1K interval session. Agreed with one of the guys to row each 1K as: 800m@1:39/200m@1:38.

Felt solid for the first 2 reps - coming in a bit ahead of target. Went out fine on #3, but then started to bonk really hard around halfway. Just could not get the power going again - limped to the end well off target. Despite numerous promises to myself to hang tough, number 4 was pretty much a repeat of #3. Just did not have it to maintain pace.

Very demoralizing. While some of it may have come down to lack of mental toughness, it was clearly not a good strategy to go harder than normal the previous day.

Lesson (re-)learned. The WP is geared to incremental improvement, but you do have to follow it. The more you mess with the plan (esp recovery day intensity), the more it messes with your performance on the hard days.

Cheers. Patrick.

[Nosmo]

Despite very good advice to the contrary (which I had followed to date), I gave in to temptation & tried out the 1:39-based pace.

You didn't even cut down on the average spm!

didn't you do another L1 earlier in the week? how'd it go? (or am I confused).

[pmacaula]

You didn't even cut down on the average spm! ...didn't you do another L1 earlier in the week?

Nosmo - more detail on other workouts in a PM, but I agree it was nuts/stupid to try the planned L4 sequences using a Ref. Pace 3" faster than what I have been doing since October. Certainly defeats the purpose of a recovery day

Cheers. Patrick.