Personal Best time v. standard workout

[Cazneau]

I'm a new rower, so forgive the dumb questions. I see that many posters list their personal best times with their messages, and PBs are also recorded on the C2 online rankings.

My question is how much slower is your standard 5k workout time from your personal best? As a runner, the "easy runs" I do a couple of times a week are significantly slower than my best 5k time, and even a little slower than my best half marathon time. I assume the same is true for rowers? As I develop technique, and focus on weight loss, I can look at the rankings of people my age and find their personal best scores, but I'm curious if there is a rule of thumb about how much slower a typical "easy row" or "moderate intensity row" pace is to a "personal best" pace. I'm mostly interested in 5k times right now, but plan to build up to 10k and half marathons.

Thanks.

[igoeja]

Although you will get more detailed prescriptions, I use a rough rule-of-thumb, in that the training/repeat pace is 5 seconds lower than the your best pace for a distance, with a decreasing proportional rest period

My current best pace for a 2K is 1:48/500 M, so my training pace is 1:52/1:53 per 500 M, but keep in mind that this is the repeat pace, and my rest period for this is 1:1 in terms of time.

1K - 1:48 per, with a 1:2 (work/rest) interval, 6 repeats
2K - 1:52/1:53 per, with a 1:1 7:15 second recovery, 5 repeats
5K - 1:57 per with a 2:1 recovery, 2 or 3 repeats
10K - 2:02 per, no repeats

As a start, you can use the online interactive training program to setup a training program and paces.

http://www.concept2.co.uk/training/interactive.php

[almostflipped]

Usually an avg. split for a 20' test or a 6k is used as a standard. If you are using a 5k you can take the times I cite and add 1-2 seconds.

Easy SS (UT2, 60-120') is 6k + 12-16
Hard SS (UT1, 45-90') is 6k + 8-12
Moderate (AT, 8-20' intervals) is 6k-1 to 6k+5
Hard (Long TR, 3-7' intervals) is 6k - 3-5
Very hard (Short TR, 30" - 3' intervals) is 6k - 5-7
Max Power (AN, 10"-30" intervals) is just flat out

The interactive guide develops its pacing using a 2k as a standard. It works too, just depends on personal preference.

[iain]

Usually an avg. split for a 20' test or a 6k is used as a standard. If you are using a 5k you can take the times I cite and add 1-2 seconds.

Easy SS (UT2, 60-120') is 6k + 12-16
Hard SS (UT1, 45-90') is 6k + 8-12
Moderate (AT, 8-20' intervals) is 6k-1 to 6k+5
Hard (Long TR, 3-7' intervals) is 6k - 3-5
Very hard (Short TR, 30" - 3' intervals) is 6k - 5-7
Max Power (AN, 10"-30" intervals) is just flat out

The interactive guide develops its pacing using a 2k as a standard. It works too, just depends on personal preference.

Interesting timings. I think that you will find a great range of paces used depending on the training philosophy and aim. Most people advocate long rows at an easy pace (2k + 20s/500m or more) several times a week. However, other sessions vary from intervals performed at a pace that is close to maximal for the session (eg popular PP see: http://www.concept2.co.uk/forum/viewtop ... start=2700 )

To an approach of always rowing within yourself. For comparison a typical HM PB would be 2k + 13-20s / 500m. Most people would aim to build up to distances of 8k+ for slower rows rather than 5k.

Sorry I can’t be more precise.

Regards

Iain

[almostflipped]

The really interesting part though is that regardless of what plan you use, or how they package it, they all basically espouse the same pacing. C2, Pete Plan, Canadian 6k, Wolverine, Bohrer, Royal, Xeno, 3S, FISA, HR, etc..... more or less the same pacing for all of them just stated in different manners (biggest difference is seen in short intervals, otherwise virtually no difference). Some slight differences exist in the proportion of work over a year (mostly the balance between UT1 and UT2, most plans include intervals in the non-racing season at this point), but even within that context the difference is much smaller than people would have you believe. Moral of the story, doesn't matter what one you choose so long as you are consistent with your work, understand the plan that is in front of you, and choose one that you feel will fit your lifestyle/interest.

[Nosmo]

Agree with all of the above, but if you are only working out three or four days a week, the paces can be much closer to your PBs then suggested by the plans. So for example if you work out four days a week, then follow the suggested paces for two interval workouts per week--really try to do all the intervals at the same pace and the average at about the fastest average pace as you can do. Then for the other two workouts you want to do a moderately long endurance piece and a long piece. So for me, I may do a 10K at 1-4 seconds slower then my 10K PB and a HM at 2-3 seconds slower. If I row five or six days in a week the paces need to be slower for the long workouts or I get too tired and don't recover.

[tiredboy]

This is quite an interesting discussion and I wondered whether anyone had any heart rate information to go with it.

I tend to do steady state 30 min sessions averaging about 70%MHR (I think this equates to UT1). It would be useful to equate this to a personal best without having to do one as my main aim is general fitness but it would be good to see how I compare to when I was rowing competitively.

I posted another thread on predicting pace from heart rate and came across a table (http://www.machars.net/ltb.xls) that made predictions for different distances/times (I think!) based on lactate levels. If I look at my pace for the session defined above then if it is UT1 it predicts a sub7 minute 2k which whilst encouraging I doubt accurate!

If the table above is accurate then it should help people plan the pace for different sessions.

Any comments appreciated.

[almostflipped]

In terms of HR, I usually used 50-60% of heart rate reserve for UT2 and 60-70% of heart rate reserve for UT1. When training that worked out to <150 for UT2 and <165 for UT1 (technically the calculations would be 146 and 162, but I add a couple beats to account for cardiac drift by the end of a piece). Past SS I always used pace based splits rather than HR.

With regard to predicting your 2k based on SS, its possible but not entirely accurate. That table will give you a ballpark figure to work with, but is meant more for determining workout ranges based on 2k rather 2k based on workout ranges. Really, as with any "Avg" range or table, it will change some with the person and never be perfect. If you want to try a 2k and haven't in some time, I would suggest adding 2 splits to whatever time it predicts. If you end up with energy at the 1000m, then you can always speed up. This won't give you a pb, but it will help prevent handling down and build confidence (and a more accurate prediction) for the next one.