New, asking for advice

M. Podolsky · Post by **M. Podolsky** » November 27th, 2008, 4:58 pm

You did the Death Ride? That's fantastic - and you should definitely be able to use an easy 10km as a rest.

In late June I rode from Salt Lake City to San Francisco with some friends. The climb up to Carson Pass was a lot of fun, but the Death Ride sounds like just a bit too much fun. However, if I lived in the area I'm sure I'd end up trying it at some point.

johnlvs2run · Post by **johnlvs2run** » November 27th, 2008, 5:20 pm

gkucera wrote:I have felt from long rides early in the season.

Try rowing for 8 hours.

gkucera · Post by **gkucera** » November 27th, 2008, 8:20 pm

John, I hope I didn't suggest that I could row 8 hours; my 42:58 second 10k just whipped my butt. I did succeed in keeping my HR at UT1 the entire session however.

It definitely felt more like cycling than 5k. I had a weight workout and rowed a hard 5k yesterday. Also, I started an hour later than I intended so was almost hungry when I started. Neither of those would have impacted a 5k row very much (not an UT1 row anway), but I was hurting the last 2k on this row.
The longer distances are what will matter for cycling and I intend to row as much above 5k as I can. I need to learn more about intervals, etc., and also need to understand when to break for water, calories. During event rides we carry 1.5 liters and stop every 90 minutes or so to fuel up on food and drink & refill water. This 10k made me wonder about stopping for water; I tanked up before and was very thirsty afterwords. Is there some rule for this when rowing, say every 10k?
Regards, George

gkucera · Post by **gkucera** » November 28th, 2008, 2:05 am

M. Podolsky wrote:You did the Death Ride? That's fantastic - and you should definitely be able to use an easy 10km as a rest.

In late June I rode from Salt Lake City to San Francisco with some friends. The climb up to Carson Pass was a lot of fun, but the Death Ride sounds like just a bit too much fun. However, if I lived in the area I'm sure I'd end up trying it at some point.

My 2009 goal is to finish the DR in 10 hours, including stops: this will be really tough for me to accomplish.
If you want to join me for a ride in California, please let me know. I live off of highway 50 just 30 minutes East of Sacramento. I will do several centuries, including the Unkown Coast, the relatively easy, but gorgeous century around Lake Tahoe, and the Folsom Century.

I surely didn't rest today rowing a UT1 10k. Wow, I have a ways to go with rowing for sure.

iain · Post by **iain** » November 28th, 2008, 8:39 am

gkucera wrote:...my 42:58 second 10k just whipped my butt. I did succeed in keeping my HR at UT1 the entire session however.
It definitely felt more like cycling than 5k.

The longer distances are what will matter for cycling and I intend to row as much above 5k as I can. I need to learn more about intervals, etc., and also need to understand when to break for water, calories. During event rides we carry 1.5 liters and stop every 90 minutes or so to fuel up on food and drink & refill water. This 10k made me wonder about stopping for water; I tanked up before and was very thirsty afterwords. Is there some rule for this when rowing, say every 10k?
Regards, George

George, I don't use HR as a guide, the use of it is a contentious issue on the forum. Just to mention a few of the issues. I have seen it stated that HRmax on the erg is lower than for running due to the position, I don't know how it relates to cycling. there are also 2 ways to interpret the UT1 cut off. There is HR drift throughout a long row. Some people set UT1 as meaning that the HR when the drift is small (say 15 mins in) needs to be in the band, but drifting outside at <2BPM/min is still UT1, while others insist that the HR bands are adhered to at all times. Te drift can get significant if you become dehydrated.

Pete has a more subjective speed for UT1 sessions, the pace at which you feel you could do the session again a couple of minutes after finishing. re drinking, few people drink during rows of <1hr, although use of a C-Breeze / fan helps this. On a TT HM few drink, but you need to drink for anything longer. Few people stop for food even during a FM, but eating (a reasonable time) before is advisable. some people prefer to split longer rows up to create drink stops, so 3x6kr90" is done quite often.

Regards

Iain

gkucera · Post by **gkucera** » November 28th, 2008, 5:57 pm

Iain,
I am no expert on HRM, but I have found it fairly accurate for assessing ride difficulty. The UT1/AT boundary is where I can maintain pace and into TR I have only five minutes or so, needing a low UT1 recovery afterwards for equal time. This has seemed to translate well into rowing so fare. My best 2k time (with hideous form) had me in upper TR/low AN(guessing) for about 5 minutes. It took me five minutes to recover my breath sitting and rowing slowly.
On my first 10k, I came up against muscle limits (i.e., poor rowing musculature) since my cardio could easily handle high UT1, but I was physically spent afterwards. I was breathing calm in a couple of minutes, but I can still feel it a bit today, after 8 hours of sleep.
Being new, I am amazed at how far I have to go before I am "good" at rowing. I hope by Spring I will be around 7 minutes 2k, sub 19m on 5k and under 40m on 10k. We will see

George

iain · Post by **iain** » November 29th, 2008, 5:03 pm

gkucera wrote:Being new, I am amazed at how far I have to go before I am "good" at rowing. I hope by Spring I will be around 7 minutes 2k, sub 19m on 5k and under 40m on 10k. We will see George

An interesting set of targets which I would expect you to achieve in reverse order (I would say 39' 10k is easier than a 7k.)

You have to realise that you can improve erg times for a number of years and so you can't expect to be the best over night.

- Iain