Concept2 Forum

Posted: **December 14th, 2005, 8:34 am**

Folks, I am so disappointed with you. You are willing to donate to buy a slide for John Rupp but not to donate to the CAUSE OF GREATER ERGING. With this attitude how are we to combat the widespread ignorance about erging and escape from our marginal position in society? Let me give you some examples of causes that are all supported by funds and foundations: Fat people <a href='http://www.naafa.org/documents/official ... ution.html' target='_blank'>http://www.naafa.org/documents/official ... tml</a> (Article II, section 5) Sea shell collecting Herbert N. Lowe Conchology Collection Fund. <a href='http://www.sdnhm.org/research/marine-inverts/' target='_blank'>http://www.sdnhm.org/research/marine-inverts/</a> Invertebrates, mollusks, microfossils <a href='http://www.eeob.iastate.edu/faculty/DrewesC/htdocs/' target='_blank'>http://www.eeob.iastate.edu/faculty/Dre ... cs/</a> Schizophrenics: the Bill Jefferies Schizophrenia Research Fund and the Helen Pfohl Fund <a href='http://www.schizophrenia.on.ca/' target='_blank'>http://www.schizophrenia.on.ca/</a> Rusty old Greek coins: Martin Price Fund for Ancient Greek Numismatics <a href='http://www.rns.dircon.co.uk/price.htm' target='_blank'>http://www.rns.dircon.co.uk/price.htm</a> Canadian Insects, Arachnids and Nematodes. <a href='http://www.canacoll.org/Misc/Pages/canacoll.htm' target='_blank'>http://www.canacoll.org/Misc/Pages/canacoll.htm</a> Yes, the godforsaken Canadian BUGS have a fund for themselves. But at least they are on earth but Near earth objects, lifeless rocks in the solar system, Gene Shoemaker grant fund <a href='http://neo.planetary.org/' target='_blank'>http://neo.planetary.org/</a> are not and The paranormal and supernatural <a href='http://www.randi.org/research/' target='_blank'>http://www.randi.org/research/</a> which has never yet been observed. All these can fund themselves but we, the ergers of the world, can't get our act together, establish a fund and donate even only a fistful of dollars to the cause of furthering erg excellence, information and public acceptance? If we want to grow and rise to public awareness we have to be willing to give rather than to receive. Each of us does not have to give much as our strength is in numbers. The fund does not have to reach great size quickly as our virtue is patience. We are already putting in an extraordinary effort of time and sweat so a small financial contribution seems little to ask. I suggest that we incorporate the INDOOR ROWING CULTURE AND EXCELLENCE FOUNDATION The foundation collects and makes available informational materials, training manuals, promotional materials, erg videos, establishes an Indoor Rowing Hall of Fame, operates a fund collecting tax deductible charitable donations and stages events such as THE ANNUAL SUPERHUMAN ERG CHALLENGE where Ranger, Dwayne and others can compete for prizes (only if they break unbelievable barriers). It should be easy to hype this up so as to generate some media interest (for example under the angle of what astonishing feats 55 year olds are still capable, how erging retards aging, health benefits etc). With the objective of contributing to athletic excellence and public health we might at some point be able to attract corporate or government sponsorship but it does take an organization to do so. The organization only needs a presence on the web (cheap). Maybe Concept2 or the Iron oarsman could consider establishing such an organization possibly with the benefit of generating tax writeoffs also. But the question remains if we are willing to donate to the cause. If we don't do it no one else will.

Posted: **December 14th, 2005, 9:28 am**

Sorry H2O, but the spirit of amateur athletics is still alive and well inthe Erging/Rowing community. In fact it would seem that actually spending great sums of money to travel and compete for a little bits of cloth and metal, or the very rare claw hammer, with no chance of financial equity is what we live for. The guy who has the official WR for 500m (Mod B, PM1) has offered $10k at least a couple times for someone to come on television and break his record, and though I'm pretty certain that even with the disadvantage of the newer PM's there are a few folks who could do it, none of them take the bait. It's tough to say exactly why, but my theory would be that people capable of such things are generally a humble group of hard workers and for the most part simply don't care about public spectacle (even well attended regattas are a small community of like minded folks) all that much. <table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>The foundation collects and makes available informational materials, training manuals, promotional materials, erg videos, establishes an Indoor Rowing Hall of Fame. </td></tr></table> Sounds a lot like C2 to me.

Posted: **December 14th, 2005, 3:54 pm**

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(H_2O)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Folks, I am so disappointed with you. </td></tr></table> Right back atcha. I'm a fan of inappropriate humor. Love Sarah Silverman, laughed my ass off at The Aristocrats. And the premise of your post is entertaining—but your execution, not so much. Listing "fat people" for comic effect on a forum that includes an entire section on weight loss is iffy at best. Including schizophrenics is beyond the pale.

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 6:43 am**

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Ducatista @ Dec 14 2005, 02:54 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I'm a fan of inappropriate humor... </td></tr></table> OK. I was expecting just something like this but not from you PaulS. But I'll get back to you later. I did suspect all along that Ducatista was an operative of the enemies of the erg. Let's not kid ourselves, the enemies of the erg are here among us. Who are they? They are upper class on the water rowers or other members of the upper class. You see, on the water rowing is an upper class hobby as evidenced by the following facts: 1. It is tremendously expensive and wasteful. You need to own waterfront property, boats, oars and have lots of leisure time (travel to and from the boat house, boat maintainance etc.), expansive space on the water. 2. It is archaic. Rowing harkens back to earlier times like horseback riding. Have you ever noticed how the boat house is the only wooden structure around for miles? 3. Succesful on the water rowers are subsequently elevated to knighthood by the Queen of England. By comparison the erg is modern and technological, a sure sign of the middle class. Can you imagine a computer chip in a boat? For this reason alone the upper class enemies of the erg will do everything to keep the erg down. So far they are winning. Have you noticed how the ergs are in smelly corners behind other equipment at fitness centers, in some dark back room in boat houses and even in our very own dwellings are rarely in the middle of the living room but are instead in the garage, in the basement or on the porch. Have you ever seen ergs that were not covered with a protective cover, were dusty or had a rust chain. I see them all the time and yes, YOUR very own erg is just like that. In short, nowhere is the erg properly venerated not even by its own adherents. This is of course due to the insidious manipulation of values by the powerful enemies of erging. So, as a first step, we must achieve awareness of the fact that the erg has enemies. That these enemies do not use outright violence but rather control the discussion of values and culture and use other subtle means to influence our thinking. Let's consider the example of DUCATISTA. He has an expensive hobby putting him firmly into the ranks of the upper class. That already makes him suspect as a possible enemy of the erg. Now let's analyze his attack on the idea of greater erging. See how it is oblique and seemingly harmless, on the face of it designed only to discredit my "execution of an otherwise entertaining premise". In passing the rise of greater erging is now characterized as "an entertaining premise" but really "inappropriate humour". Yes, that is exactly what the coccky enemies of the erg are thinking so sure are they that the erg will never rise. Then he cleverly sows discord into our ranks implying that I insulted "beyond the pale" the overweight and schizophrenic among us. Well I am overweight myself but I can guarentee you that Ducatista is not. You see now what we are up against? But it does not stop here. Other potential enemies of the erg are all the people maintaining that the 2K is the only worthy erg race, all other distances being just a fun hobby. They maintain that everyone posting a fast time must then also deliver a fast 2K in a public race. Those that do deliver spectacular 2K times are then prompted to move into boats, thereby being coopted by the enemy and eliminated as leaders of the movement to greater erging. Examples are: Ranger, Roland, Dwayne. First they are ergers, suddenly you hear that they have boats. But let us not worry. The rise of greater erging is as inevitable as the spread of mass manufactured goods. We shall overcome!

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 8:51 am**

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(H_2O @ Dec 15 2005, 05:43 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Ducatista @ Dec 14 2005, 02:54 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I'm a fan of inappropriate humor... </td></tr></table> OK. I was expecting just something like this but not from you PaulS. But I'll get back to you later. I did suspect all along that Ducatista was an operative of the enemies of the erg. Let's not kid ourselves, the enemies of the erg are here among us. Who are they? They are upper class on the water rowers or other members of the upper class. You see, on the water rowing is an upper class hobby as evidenced by the following facts: 1. It is tremendously expensive and wasteful. You need to own waterfront property, boats, oars and have lots of leisure time (travel to and from the boat house, boat maintainance etc.), expansive space on the water. 2. It is archaic. Rowing harkens back to earlier times like horseback riding. Have you ever noticed how the boat house is the only wooden structure around for miles? 3. Succesful on the water rowers are subsequently elevated to knighthood by the Queen of England. By comparison the erg is modern and technological, a sure sign of the middle class. Can you imagine a computer chip in a boat? For this reason alone the upper class enemies of the erg will do everything to keep the erg down. So far they are winning. Have you noticed how the ergs are in smelly corners behind other equipment at fitness centers, in some dark back room in boat houses and even in our very own dwellings are rarely in the middle of the living room but are instead in the garage, in the basement or on the porch. Have you ever seen ergs that were not covered with a protective cover, were dusty or had a rust chain. I see them all the time and yes, YOUR very own erg is just like that. In short, nowhere is the erg properly venerated not even by its own adherents. This is of course due to the insidious manipulation of values by the powerful enemies of erging. So, as a first step, we must achieve awareness of the fact that the erg has enemies. That these enemies do not use outright violence but rather control the discussion of values and culture and use other subtle means to influence our thinking. Let's consider the example of DUCATISTA. He has an expensive hobby putting him firmly into the ranks of the upper class. That already makes him suspect as a possible enemy of the erg. Now let's analyze his attack on the idea of greater erging. See how it is oblique and seemingly harmless, on the face of it designed only to discredit my "execution of an otherwise entertaining premise". In passing the rise of greater erging is now characterized as "an entertaining premise" but really "inappropriate humour". Yes, that is exactly what the coccky enemies of the erg are thinking so sure are they that the erg will never rise. Then he cleverly sows discord into our ranks implying that I insulted "beyond the pale" the overweight and schizophrenic among us. Well I am overweight myself but I can guarentee you that Ducatista is not. You see now what we are up against? But it does not stop here. Other potential enemies of the erg are all the people maintaining that the 2K is the only worthy erg race, all other distances being just a fun hobby. They maintain that everyone posting a fast time must then also deliver a fast 2K in a public race. Those that do deliver spectacular 2K times are then prompted to move into boats, thereby being coopted by the enemy and eliminated as leaders of the movement to greater erging. Examples are: Ranger, Roland, Dwayne. First they are ergers, suddenly you hear that they have boats. But let us not worry. The rise of greater erging is as inevitable as the spread of mass manufactured goods. We shall overcome! </td></tr></table> What a load of tripe. And I thought that the first post in this tread was bad...........until I saw this bunch of sensless drivel. No one is trying to keep the erg down, it is an essential part of training for OTW rowers as well. You do not have to own water front property. Generally waterways are public the same as roads. Unless you live in some extreme communist regime that says otherwise. Anyone can use a waterway if and when they please. As far as time goes, yes you do need time, but not much more than you do for erging. And as for the money aspect, I have one question, Do you own your own erg?? If you do you are a lot better off than I am, as I cant afford to pay out almost £1000 pounds for one yet, but I still row OTW. I suppose this makes me Upper Middle class?? How wrong you are. My mother is a nurse and my father works on buliding sites............hardly upper class. You say it is expensive, yes boats are expensive, but you are not going to buy a 4 or an 8 just for yourself. Thats why here in the real world there are things like CLUBS............maybe you have heard of them. You know places where people go to train together. Currently the club I row for charges Annual membership of £50............wow, a whole £50, almost extortionate wouldnt you say, and this includes all fees for races, and we are coached by some of the more experienced members, no professional coaches. It is because of you and people like you that rowing OTW has been tarred with the "upper class" brush for many years. And as for your comment that the "Enemies of the erg" (I will assume you mean OTW rowers) say that the only "real" race distance is 2km, how wrong you are. The entire winter season is made up of races between 3.5 km to 6 km, on various types of waterways (rivers - canals - lakes) and so training has to be carried out for these distances, much of it on the ergo, which as I said at the start of this is essential for anyone who rows. And in my eyes any distance, be it a 2km or a marathon, done on the erg deserves respect from anyone, and by your trying to seperate and alienate people with this pointless thread you are only try to keep alive a problem that really only exists in you head. Cheers

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 10:27 am**

Dude. 1. (On the water) Rowing clubs are cheap to join - I don't know ANY amateur rowers with their own boats. 2. Yes. And. So. What. Walking and running are even more archaic. Surely games like Polo and grouse shooting are more middle/upper class, perhaps seen as a status symbol past-time maybe ? 3. A 5-time Olympic Champion being knighted ? Well, why not ? Steve Redgrave advocates the use of indoor rowers, has set up charitable causes, surely him being recognised in this way gives rowing more positive publicity, which is a good thing surely ? "By comparison the erg is modern and technological, a sure sign of the middle class. Can you imagine a computer chip in a boat?" digital watches, microwaves, mobile phones, calculators all have chips. Is a digital watch middle class ? "Have you noticed how the ergs are in smelly corners behind other equipment at fitness centers, in some dark back room in boat houses and even in our very own dwellings are rarely in the middle of the living room but are instead in the garage, in the basement or on the porch." Nope on the first count. On the second mine is in my living room - it won't fit anywhere else. "Have you ever seen ergs that were not covered with a protective cover, were dusty or had a rust chain. I see them all the time and yes, YOUR very own erg is just like that." Umm, having saved up and shelled out for one i keep it in good nick, cleaned and lubricated regularly, same as I would do with a car. I'd guess (only my opinion mind) that most people keep theirs in good nick too. Are you trying to be the Karl Marx of erging ? Urging the common proletariat rowers to rise up against the evil opressor OTW rowers ? But surely if we rise up and break our chains we won't be able to row ??

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 11:20 am**

Okay H2O, You "GOT ME".

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 12:19 pm**

Hi H20, I enjoyed your tongue-in-cheek posting. Count me as one who finds OTW rowing a very inexpensive hobby, say compared to running or cycling. Just think of the cost of good running shoes and good tires, for example, and how much you spend each year on those things. Our local rowing club charges a very modest fee each year and has a nice collection of boats for the members. I enjoy erging and rowing on the water, but I think this puts it nicely: `The ergometer simulates the physical demands of rowing, packaging the pains with none of the amenities that make it worthwhile ...' - from Kiesling's The Shell Game. Byron

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 1:49 pm**

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(H_2O)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Let's consider the example of DUCATISTA. He has an expensive hobby putting him firmly into the ranks of the upper class. That already makes him suspect as a possible enemy of the erg. </td></tr></table> Once again, a premise with promise, but execution is your downfall. He's a she.

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 2:23 pm**

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Ducatista @ Dec 15 2005, 09:49 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(H_2O)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Let's consider the example of DUCATISTA. He has an expensive hobby putting him firmly into the ranks of the upper class. That already makes him suspect as a possible enemy of the erg. </td></tr></table> Once again, a premise with promise, but execution is your downfall. He's a she. </td></tr></table> Actually "he" is 2/3's of "she", "he's" would be just a touch over and out of order.

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 2:50 pm**

H_2O, You have indeed achieved forum posting excellence.

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 4:03 pm**

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(H_2O @ Dec 15 2005, 03:43 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> By comparison the erg is modern and technological, a sure sign of the middle class. Can you imagine a computer chip in a boat? </td></tr></table> I didn't have to imagine it. I had one when I had a boat. In fact it is still stored away unused, since I no longer have a boat. It is called a Speed Coach, made by NK. On another note, even horseback riding has been invaded by modern technology. Saddles made of wood and leather are being replaced those made with artificial materials. Bob S. P.S. But yes, I did enjoy reading your satirical piece.

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 7:15 pm**

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(H_2O @ Dec 15 2005, 11:43 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>... I did suspect all along that Ducatista was an operative of the enemies of the erg. Let's not kid ourselves, the enemies of the erg are here among us. Who are they? They are upper class on the water rowers or other members of the upper class. You see, on the water rowing is an upper class hobby as evidenced by the following facts: </td></tr></table> Hey, great analysis. Are all those ideas your own? Where does your nick (H_2O) come from if you are not On-The-H2O-rowing? Is yours an upper class nick??? Have you ever heard of any real erger named H2O??? What about the Danube? Much to expensive to maintain for any prolet! Definitively H2_O is cheating us, he is an under cover OTW-(and thus "enemy of the erg") rowing agent. Or completely schizophrene, which again links us to his first post in this thread. I even suspect he is a hidden single sculler, and have heard he loves rowing in wooden boats, preferabily with swiss peocedence (no chips!) You have been caught by the dark side!

Posted: **December 15th, 2005, 11:37 pm**

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(ancho @ Dec 15 2005, 06:15 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(H_2O @ Dec 15 2005, 11:43 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>... I did suspect all along that Ducatista was an operative of the enemies of the erg. Let's not kid ourselves, the enemies of the erg are here among us. Who are they? They are upper class on the water rowers or other members of the upper class. You see, on the water rowing is an upper class hobby as evidenced by the following facts: </td></tr></table> Hey, great analysis. Are all those ideas your own? Where does your nick (H_2O) come from if you are not On-The-H2O-rowing? Is yours an upper class nick??? Have you ever heard of any real erger named H2O??? What about the Danube? Much to expensive to maintain for any prolet! Definitively H2_O is cheating us, he is an under cover OTW-(and thus "enemy of the erg") rowing agent. Or completely schizophrene, which again links us to his first post in this thread. I even suspect he is a hidden single sculler, and have heard he loves rowing in wooden boats, preferabily with swiss peocedence (no chips!) You have been caught by the dark side! </td></tr></table> YES!!! That's It!!! H2O is an undercover single sculler in a timber boat. Something like a cross dresser. He sneaks out in his timber scull, hoping not to be seen, then reverts back to his erg. Then acuses Ranger, Dwayne and myself of being turncoats. And do you know why he still persists with a timber boat???? Have you ever seen a min. weight carbon fiber cuckoo clock??? Nope, I sure haven't. I love my erg(with Rowpro) and my new boat. But don't we all have days where we wake up and can't decide between taking the Porsche for a spin or playing the racer on the Xbox video game. Rockin Roland

Posted: **December 16th, 2005, 8:07 am**

[right] [/quote] I love my erg(with Rowpro) and my new boat. But don't we all have days where we wake up and can't decide between taking the Porsche for a spin or playing the racer on the Xbox video game. Rockin Roland [/quote] Porsche ?? X-Box ??? DEFINITE middle class there Roland Eanna happily driving a 6 year old Audi.

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