Paul Smith's 5:36.8 For The 2k

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Aug 25 2005, 04:12 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Aug 25 2005, 04:12 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->My PR was a 5:36.8[right] </td></tr></table><br />The current world record is 5:37.0 by Mathis Siejkowski, also Olympic Champion on the water, 6'10, 230 pounds. <br /><br />The previous world record was held by Rob Waddell, also Olympic Champion on the water, 6'8, 230 pounds.<br /><br />Paul Smith thinks he rowed a time faster than both of them. Did he really? I am curious what the rest of you think, and wonder how many others agree. Or was it more likely a typical college level row in the range of 6:10 to 6:40. Paul's fastest time in the last 5 years is a 6:34. Let's look at some of the facts of the time in question.<br /><br />(1) It was rowed on a model A with no drag factor. No drag factor means the resistance could changed dramatically depending on how close to walls, other machines, and how many people were standing close to the cage. <br /><br />(2) Paul Smith was approximately 6'1, and 195 pounds at the time, not nearly the height and weight of the Olympic Champions who supposedly rowed slower some 20 years later.<br /><br />(3) The time was done in closed session and not announced for several days. How do we know the time wasn't just made up or created to try and boost the team's ego. Certainly it has done that for Paul.<br /><br />(4) The trials were timed by stop watch by cowswains. Certainly these were not scientific or race standard circumstances. Such conditions would not be acceptable for even ranking verification today.<br /><br />(5) Paul apparently believes the time was equivalent to the same on a Model B, C, or D. Perhaps he could comment directly on that, though it is easy to see that it isn't.<br /><br />Personally I think he rowed about a 6:35 effort, the same that he has done at his best in the last few years, now being older but also 40 pounds heavier.<br /><br />What do the rest of you think?

[[old] Mark Keating]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Aug 28 2005, 10:53 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Aug 28 2005, 10:53 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->What do the rest of you think? <br /> </td></tr></table><br />I wasn't there so I can't vouch for Paul but I have no reason not to believe him. <br /><br />What I really think, based on practically everything you have ever posted on this forum, is that you are an idiot. Get a life.

[[old] gw1]

Where did you get that quote?<br /><br />I'm sure with Paul's active forum participation and coaching profile he would not post a bogus time without some valid proof!<br />Being just a tad over 6' 1" myself i don't think it is possible for a 6'1" to break 6:48.0 for 2000, i'm pretty sure it hasn't been done.<br /><br />Cheers<br />GW

[[old] slo_boat]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Aug 28 2005, 10:53 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Aug 28 2005, 10:53 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Aug 25 2005, 04:12 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Aug 25 2005, 04:12 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->My PR was a 5:36.8[right] </td></tr></table><br />The current world record is 5:37.0 by Mathis Siejkowski, also Olympic Champion on the water, 6'10, 230 pounds. <br /><br />The previous world record was held by Rob Waddell, also Olympic Champion on the water, 6'8, 230 pounds.<br /><br />Paul Smith thinks . . .<br /><br /><text deleted for berivty><br /><br />Personally I think he rowed about a 6:35 effort, the same that he has done at his best in the last few years, now being older but also 40 pounds heavier.<br /><br />What do the rest of you think? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />I think you ought to be ashamed of yourself. This post says a heck of a lot more about you than it does about Paul S.<br /><br />You have read a lot into Paul S' post about something that he did a long time ago, and you have added context that he never claimed in an effort to denigrate him. You should dust off some of that "life coaching" that you do and see what this sort of behavior says about you.<br /><br />Did he do what he says he did? I think so. Does the fact that the Model A is not a Model C or D mean anything? Sure. It means that comparison across machines given their very different technology is silly. Paul S never said that the time would be equivilent. He not only did not claim that the time was "race equivilent" he explained how the time was taken. <br /><br />To give you a little context, in the days that Paul was describing, the erg was not thought of as anything other than substitute for water. I don't think many people envisioned that indoor rowing would someday be a real sport. The type of time trial that he described is not much different than cycling roller races or informal treadmill races. Ergs may have been used by some teams as a supplement to seat races to help determine who went in which boat or who rowed in which race, but that was about as far as it went. For you try to change the context is dishonest.<br /><br />(Does this response gain me admission to the Iggie Bin?)

[[old] slo_boat]

<!--QuoteBegin-gw1+Aug 28 2005, 11:27 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(gw1 @ Aug 28 2005, 11:27 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Where did you get that quote? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />He took it out of context from a post that Paul made in another thread. Without the context, it is meaningless. <br /><br /><a href='http://concept2.ipbhost.com/index.php?s ... 1974&st=60' target='_blank'>http://concept2.ipbhost.com/index.php?s ... 4&st=60</a> <br /><br />It's near the bottom of the page. It's a great story, and it rings true to anyone who ever spent any time in a boat house or remembers the Model A.

[[old] dadams]

John...John...John...Get a life man. Sounds to me like maybe you're a bit on the envious side of things. Wishing you could do a sub-six. <br /><br />I finally had a chance to meet Paul in person in Edmonton. One of the nicest people you'll ever have the pleasure of meeting. <br /><br /><b>Please</b> lay off the crap eh?<br /><br />Some of the stuff you and Paul bantor over is fun reading. But attacking his integrety ain't cool man.<br /><br />Dwayne

[[old] dadams]

<!--QuoteBegin-slo_boat+Aug 28 2005, 11:47 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(slo_boat @ Aug 28 2005, 11:47 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-gw1+Aug 28 2005, 11:27 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(gw1 @ Aug 28 2005, 11:27 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Where did you get that quote? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />He took it out of context from a post that Paul made in another thread. Without the context, it is meaningless. <br /><br /><a href='http://concept2.ipbhost.com/index.php?s ... 1974&st=60' target='_blank'>http://concept2.ipbhost.com/index.php?s ... 4&st=60</a> <br /><br />It's near the bottom of the page. It's a great story, and it rings true to anyone who ever spent any time in a boat house or remembers the Model A. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /><br />Good point. He is talking about a 4 mile distance here. <br /><br />John seems to have read what he wanted to read, and not what was written.<br /><br />Dwayne

[[old] Coach Gus]

<!--QuoteBegin-gw1+Aug 28 2005, 08:27 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(gw1 @ Aug 28 2005, 08:27 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Being just a tad over 6' 1" myself i don't think it is possible for a 6'1" to break 6:48.0 for 2000, i'm pretty sure it hasn't been done.<br /> <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Isn't Ranger 5'11" or so? He's done 6:28 something. Now if you meant 5:48, that's another story.

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-gw1+Aug 28 2005, 09:27 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(gw1 @ Aug 28 2005, 09:27 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Where did you get that quote?<br /><br />I'm sure with Paul's active forum participation and coaching profile he would not post a bogus time without some valid proof!<br />Being just a tad over 6' 1" myself i don't think it is possible for a 6'1" to break 6:48.0 for 2000, i'm pretty sure it hasn't been done.<br /><br />Cheers<br />GW[right] </td></tr></table><br />Gary,<br /><br />I agree with you. Here is the full quote:<br /><br /><!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Aug 25 2005, 04:12 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Aug 25 2005, 04:12 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->My PR was a 5:36.8 for 4 miles on a Model A (when 5 miles was the standard distance[right] </td></tr></table><br />Then this was added:<br /><!--QuoteBegin-bmoore+Aug 25 2005, 04:50 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(bmoore @ Aug 25 2005, 04:50 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The old model A had a different gearing... a mile equalled 500 meters with the old gearing, therefore this would actually be a 2k time equivalent.[right] </td></tr></table><br /><br />So the question is, Dwayne and Gary et all, do you think Paul Smith did a 5:36.8 that is equivalent to the same time on a Model D, or is the time totally irrelevant.

[[old] dadams]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Aug 28 2005, 12:21 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Aug 28 2005, 12:21 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->So the question is, Dwayne and Gary et all, do you think Paul Smith did a 5:36.8 that is equivalent to the same time on a Model D, or is the time totally irrelevant. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />I think the real question is why do you give a rat's a**? Why the debate? <br /><br />The two models were/are different. Paul has stated that fact.

[[old] csabour]

i think he wants to know because PaulS might have broken a world record.

[[old] John Rupp]

Yes if this time is legitimate then we should make sure it is added to the listing of World Records.<br /><br />Apparently some people think that it is.<br /><br />Others think that Matthias Siejkowski has the fastest time, and thus have given him the World Record.

[[old] R S T]

<!--QuoteBegin-Mark Keating+Aug 28 2005, 04:22 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Mark Keating @ Aug 28 2005, 04:22 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Aug 28 2005, 10:53 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Aug 28 2005, 10:53 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->What do the rest of you think? <br /> </td></tr></table><br />I wasn't there so I can't vouch for Paul but I have no reason not to believe him. <br /><br />What I really think, based on practically everything you have ever posted on this forum, is that you are an idiot. Get a life. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /> <br /><br />In the original context, I had commented to John R that his PATT system were a load of b o l l o c k s and happened to mention that in any event he was not applying PaulS's best 2k time.<br /><br />PaulS raised corrected my guess at his time (I think I guessed at 5:39, based on my recollection of a post on the old forum) and provided us with a little background to the time trial. His account would appear to be consistent with what he once stated in the old forum. I have no reason to doubt PaulS's integrity whatsoever and I believe that PaulS was not in any way boasting - he was merely responding to a question that I had raised regarding his 2k PB. <br /><br />Whether a model A time is truly comparable with a model B/C or D time is irrelevant here - I think we all agree that the current world record time and holder is not in dispute. What is concerning though is that John R would appear to be attacking Paul's integrity. <br /><br />Perhaps Concept2 personnel can comment on the comparability of times between the various models??????<br /><br />Oh, and John R, please stop the rot.<br /><br />Cheers<br />RichardT

[[old] gw1]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->QUOTE(gw1 @ Aug 28 2005, 08:27 AM)<br />Being just a tad over 6' 1" myself i don't think it is possible for a 6'1" to break 6:48.0 for 2000, i'm pretty sure it hasn't been done.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Isn't Ranger 5'11" or so? He's done 6:28 something. Now if you meant 5:48, that's another story.<br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Gus <br /><br />Sorry, i slipped meant 5:48! Hurrying to get back to Katrina prep!<br /><br />GW

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Aug 25 2005, 04:12 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Aug 25 2005, 04:12 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->My PR was a 5:36.8[right] </td></tr></table><br />Paul -is- claiming that his best time for a 2k is 5:36.8.<br /><br />Some here appear to believe, as he claims, that 5:36.8 is really his PB for a 2k.