Ranger - News To Shock

[[old] NavigationHazard]

Now now, Paul, Lactate is a cruel mistress to us all....<br /><br />"Please, Ma'am! May I have another???"<br /><br />"Okay. Ready, ROW!!!" <br /><br />

[[old] hjs]

<!--QuoteBegin-NavigationHazard+Jan 9 2006, 03:48 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(NavigationHazard @ Jan 9 2006, 03:48 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Now now, Paul, Lactate is a cruel mistress to us all....<br /><br />"Please, Ma'am!  May I have another???"<br /><br />"Okay.  Ready, ROW!!!"  <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /><br />You remind me of something. years ago a former gym buddie om mine also erged a bit. We needed him for a 4 x 1k contest. he trained a bit and did the 4 x 1 and one week later we also did a erg race in Essen. (the best there is, it's on music and lights and all , really great) But that to he side.<br /><br /><br /><br />Afterwards we drove home and out off the blue he said spoke the memorable words : Today I discovered H**L, It's a erg 2 k contest, and every time you finish the meters go back to 2000 and you have to row over and over. (he rowed 6,31)

[[old] ranger]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->t's a great time for that 500m "checkpoint", a 1:24 would coincide nicely with Graham's 1:14.8 and his 1:27.5 2k paces. </td></tr></table><br /><br />I've started to play around with this and will do some work on it every day. 1:24 does indeed come pretty readily at 44 spm, just with normal stroking. The power is there: 13.4 SPI @ 44 spm.<br /><br />ranger

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-ranger+Jan 9 2006, 08:01 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 9 2006, 08:01 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->t's a great time for that 500m "checkpoint", a 1:24 would coincide nicely with Graham's 1:14.8 and his 1:27.5 2k paces. </td></tr></table><br /><br />I've started to play around with this and will do some work on it every day. 1:24 does indeed come pretty readily at 44 spm, just with normal stroking. The power is there: 13.4 SPI @ 44 spm.<br /><br />ranger <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />That doesn't seem quite "normal" stroking as it would be only about 8m/stroke and would take 62 strokes to complete the 500m. It's also not that much power, it's similar in profile to what is needed for a 1:52 @ S10PS, with only the rate being changed to 44 to drop the pace to 1:24. Though without the higher ratio, even that profile becomes quite tiring pretty quickly.<br /><br />If the power is there, just do it. <br /><br />BTW - Comparing yourself to some "upper limit of performance" by looking to published WR's in age classes is not particularly valid in such a young sport, why limit yourself? Just do your best and that's good enough, no need to speculate on what you can do.

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-NavigationHazard+Jan 9 2006, 12:59 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(NavigationHazard @ Jan 9 2006, 12:59 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I prefer to do the majority of my 20 spm work at lower, preponderantly fat-burning intensities </td></tr></table><br />You burn less fat at 20 spm, than at higher ratings. <br /><br /><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->that don't overstress my body. </td></tr></table><br />Careful you don't overstress yourself.

[[old] NavigationHazard]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Jan 9 2006, 12:12 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jan 9 2006, 12:12 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-NavigationHazard+Jan 9 2006, 12:59 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(NavigationHazard @ Jan 9 2006, 12:59 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I prefer to do the majority of my 20 spm work at lower, preponderantly fat-burning intensities </td></tr></table><br />You burn less fat at 20 spm, than at higher ratings. <br /><br /><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->that don't overstress my body. </td></tr></table><br />Careful you don't overstress yourself. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Wrong. In and of itself, your rating has next to nothing to do with how much fat you do or don't burn. The main determinant is how much work your body is doing at a given rating.<br /><br />It is true that you may burn more fat in aggregate at higher subthreshold intensities -- NOT ratings -- than lower, if the total caloric expenditure is sufficiently high to offset the lower percentage of fat utilized by the body. But if you work too hard for too long you will overstress your body.<br /><br />Since you apparently row everything at 38 spm and about 60 DF and single-digit spi I don't expect you to understand what overstressing your body feels like.

[[old] ranger]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->That doesn't seem quite "normal" stroking as it would be only about 8m/stroke and would take 62 strokes to complete the 500m. </td></tr></table><br /><br />Give me a break, Paul. At 44 spm, 13.4 SPI is entirely respectable stroking power for a 55-year-old lwt. Sure, I would be delighted if I had more gas than that at that rating, but I am afraid that's just about it, if I want to hold my technique together. <br /><br />Yes, I would need 62 strokes, and that is a lot. I would need to trade rate for pace pretty agressively after about 1:31 @ 33 spm (14 SPI). I can't do 15 SPI @ 34 spm (1:28) for any appareciable distance.<br /><br />If there are other 55-year-old lwts who can, I would like to meet them. <br /><br />As far as I can tell, the best reported 55-year-old 500m so far is 1:28.8.<br /><br />ranger<br /><br />P.S. This rowing is at 155 df. I suppose I could raise the drag to see if I could get more power that way.

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-NavigationHazard+Jan 9 2006, 09:41 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(NavigationHazard @ Jan 9 2006, 09:41 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->In and of itself, your rating has next to nothing to do with how much fat you do or don't burn.  [right] </td></tr></table><br /><br />Is that why you weigh 250 pounds?<br /><br /><br />

[[old] John Rupp]

I would lower the drag to a factor of 120 to 125 or so.<br /><br />The DF for a 2k is different than doing 500 meters. You can feel great for 500 meters and then resting, but you want a DF that's going to take you through a 2k feeling relatively good all the way, and not getting bogged down by the weight. Also, the lower the DF, the less peaks and valleys of fan speed with each stroke. Yet 120 to 125 is still plenty high enough to give you the output. Eskild Ebbesen uses in the range of 117 to 121 for the drag factor, 8 meters per stroke, and 62 strokes for the 2k. Elia Luini does the same.<br /><br />This is quite normal stroking for top lightweights.

[[old] NavigationHazard]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Jan 9 2006, 01:52 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jan 9 2006, 01:52 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-NavigationHazard+Jan 9 2006, 09:41 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(NavigationHazard @ Jan 9 2006, 09:41 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->In and of itself, your rating has next to nothing to do with how much fat you do or don't burn.  [right] </td></tr></table><br /><br />Is that why you weigh 250 pounds? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />No, I weigh 250 pounds because I've eaten too many annoying lightweights for lunch.<br /><br />There also are the 100 lbs or so of brain to consider, and the 50 lbs of cojones.<br /><br />How much do you weigh. again?

[[old] gw1]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Eskild Ebbesen uses in the range of 117 to 121 for the drag factor, 8 meters per stroke, and 62 strokes for the 2k. </td></tr></table><br /><br />Ugh!!!! These numbers don't quite add up do they?

[[old] gw1]

<!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->No, I weigh 250 pounds because I've eaten too many annoying lightweights for lunch.<br /><br />There also are the 100 lbs or so of brain to consider, and the 50 lbs of cojones.<br /><br />How much do you weigh. again? </td></tr></table><br /><br />This is why you don't poke the bear!!! <br /><br />Great reply!!<br /><br />If you chose, you are now officially FB3, PaulS will swear you in!<br /><br />Cheers<br />GW<br />

[[old] DavidA]

<!--QuoteBegin-NavigationHazard+Jan 9 2006, 02:46 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(NavigationHazard @ Jan 9 2006, 02:46 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Jan 9 2006, 01:52 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jan 9 2006, 01:52 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-NavigationHazard+Jan 9 2006, 09:41 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(NavigationHazard @ Jan 9 2006, 09:41 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->In and of itself, your rating has next to nothing to do with how much fat you do or don't burn.  [right] </td></tr></table><br /><br />Is that why you weigh 250 pounds? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />No, I weigh 250 pounds because I've eaten too many annoying lightweights for lunch.<br /><br />There also are the 100 lbs or so of brain to consider, and the 50 lbs of cojones.<br /><br />How much do you weigh. again? <br /> </td></tr></table><br />

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-ranger+Jan 9 2006, 10:38 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ranger @ Jan 9 2006, 10:38 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Give me a break, Paul. At 44 spm, 13.4 SPI is entirely respectable stroking power for a 55-year-old lwt. Sure, I would be delighted if I had more gas than that at that rating, but I am afraid that's just about it, if I want to hold my technique together. <br /> </td></tr></table><br />It's not more gas, it's more hp and ftlbs that you are going to need.<br />Why should I give you a break, you want this don't you?<br /><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Yes, I would need 62 strokes, and that is a lot. I would need to trade rate for pace pretty agressively after about 1:31 @ 33 spm (14 SPI). I can't do 15 SPI @ 34 spm (1:28) for any appareciable distance.<br /> </td></tr></table><br />You've already traded it for that, not much more to trade at this point.<br />Yes, it is a lot, but only about a quarter of what you are going to need for your 2k.<br /><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->If there are other 55-year-old lwts who can, I would like to meet them. <br /><br />As far as I can tell, the best reported 55-year-old 500m so far is 1:28.8.<br /><br />ranger<br /> </td></tr></table><br />Like I said, you aren't talking about doing what others have done, you want to accomplish far more from what you go on an on about.<br /><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->P.S. This rowing is at 155 df.  I suppose I could raise the drag to see if I could  get more power that way. <br /> </td></tr></table><br />Increasing the DF is a crutch, not a free lunch.

[[old] PaulS]

<!--QuoteBegin-gw1+Jan 9 2006, 12:24 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(gw1 @ Jan 9 2006, 12:24 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->No, I weigh 250 pounds because I've eaten too many annoying lightweights for lunch.<br /><br />There also are the 100 lbs or so of brain to consider, and the 50 lbs of cojones.<br /><br />How much do you weigh. again? </td></tr></table><br /><br />This is why you don't poke the bear!!! <br /><br />Great reply!!<br /><br />If you chose, you are now officially FB3, PaulS will swear you in!<br /><br />Cheers<br />GW <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />H3LL Yes! Welcome abroad, ooops, I mean aboard!<br />Now swear a little bit, and it's official.