How Do You Overcome Height Disadvantages?

[[old] Coach Gus]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Nov 23 2005, 06:23 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Nov 23 2005, 06:23 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->ljwagner,<br /><br />I like your ideas.<br /><br />They make perfect sense to me. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />This makes perfect sense.<br />

[[old] Coach Gus]

<!--QuoteBegin-Dickie+Nov 23 2005, 08:09 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Dickie @ Nov 23 2005, 08:09 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-PaulS+Nov 22 2005, 06:12 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(PaulS @ Nov 22 2005, 06:12 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><br /><br />Was "The Blue Monster" really 'green'?   <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />I also used the old Gamut Ergometer When I was at Worcester Polytechnic Institute in 1974-5. Ours was Blue. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Now visiting OSU where they have two Gamut ergs. Having seen theirs I'm not sure it was the same kind of erg we used at SCU. I recall some saying that one was made by some of the engineering students. One thing for sure is the Gamut erg feels very different than a C2 erg.

[[old] Coach Gus]

<!--QuoteBegin-ljwagner+Nov 24 2005, 06:04 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ljwagner @ Nov 24 2005, 06:04 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Crab at the finish, so my hands were in front of my chest already.  <br /> <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />It's statements like this one that are confusing. Is there ever a time when you are rowing that you are rowing correctly when your arms aren't already in front of your chest? A crab at the finish could mean your arms end up above your chest as the oar is on it's way over your head, but I can't figure any other time it would be happening. <br />

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-Coach Gus+Nov 25 2005, 05:04 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Coach Gus @ Nov 25 2005, 05:04 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->It's statements like this one that are confusing. [right] </td></tr></table><br /><br />Statements like this one are confusing.<br />

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-Coach Gus+Nov 25 2005, 05:04 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Coach Gus @ Nov 25 2005, 05:04 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Is there ever a time when you are rowing that you are rowing correctly when your arms aren't already in front of your chest? [right] </td></tr></table><br /><br />Sometimes my hands are above or in front of my feet.<br /><br />Other times they are in front of my knees, or above my legs.<br /><br />I've never heard of anyone rowing with them right in front of their chest all the time.<br /><br />That sounds very interesting!

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-Byron Drachman+Nov 25 2005, 09:45 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Byron Drachman @ Nov 25 2005, 09:45 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Hi John,<br /><br />Have you tried it? Can you improve any of your times with this method?[right] </td></tr></table><br /><br />Hi Byron,<br /><br />It sounds like the same way I row all the time, but perhaps I am not understanding the explanation correctly since you and Jim have differing interpretations.

[[old] John Rupp]

One of the best examples of this was Rob Waddell, in a few seconds clip as part of a C2 crash b tape.<br /><br />After the catch, his upper body was virtually motionless at the same angle all the way through the drive to the finish.

[[old] John Rupp]

What would really be useful is to see people racing.<br /><br />The most useful video I have is of Eskild Ebbesen racing a 2k.<br /><br />It would likewise be useful to see others, like Rob Waddell and Elia Luini, racing through a full 2k.<br /><br />Then we can see exactly what they do and how they race all the way through.

[[old] Coach Gus]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Nov 25 2005, 05:26 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Nov 25 2005, 05:26 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-Coach Gus+Nov 25 2005, 05:04 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Coach Gus @ Nov 25 2005, 05:04 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Is there ever a time when you are rowing that you are rowing correctly when your arms aren't already in front of your chest? [right] </td></tr></table><br /><br />Sometimes my hands are above or in front of my feet.<br /><br />Other times they are in front of my knees, or above my legs.<br /><br />I've never heard of anyone rowing with them right in front of their chest all the time.<br /><br />That sounds very interesting! <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />This explains a lot. So sometimes they are in front of your knees or above your legs, but behind your chest. Interesting use of body lean. Is this at the catch or at the finish or during the whole stroke?<br />

[[old] John Rupp]

<!--QuoteBegin-Coach Gus+Nov 25 2005, 05:46 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Coach Gus @ Nov 25 2005, 05:46 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->sometimes they are in front of your knees or above your legs, but behind your chest.  </td></tr></table><br /><br />Could you show us a video? <br />

[[old] ljwagner]

Its nice to get a few marginal votes for sanity. <br /><br />Barry, that video looks pretty good. By opening the angle at the hips that small amount prior to the drive, you gain a safer stronger drive position as in a squating exercise. To feel the effect of the angle change at the drive more, put the erg at the heaviest damper setting. In the proper position, you may move slow, but legs will feel the load, not the low back.<br /><br />I can't say much about the technique's history. But I definitely recall Coach Farwell's saying it was used by the German 4 at the 64' Olympics.<br /><br />A couple questions, especially for coaches.<br /><br />To start a race, what position are rowers supposed to be in ? <br />Over the X (1/2 slide), ready to drive ? <br />Is that with a lean to bow slightly, or leaning deep to stern ?<br /><br /> If it is with a slight lean to bow, as in a strong weightlifting position, that makes sense. What this technique employs, is to get at that strong drive position for every stroke. <br /><br />Our Frosh 8 opened the racing season with these weights:<br /> 165, 165, 205, 185, 160, 145, 145, 160, with a 130 lb coxswain.<br /><br />Coach had the choice of something unorthodox but technically proven, or watch us seriously get out butts kicked every race. <br /><br />My sophmore year, the Freshman included a former pole vaulter (fantastic athletes), and a outrigger canoe paddler with incredible low back strength. They did not straighten up, and apparently did not need to. Some of their Frosh 8 may have rowed the technique my boat used. But fewer and fewer did, as the team got bigger personnel. It gave lwts an advantage, but most new hvwts were strong enough that they did not care for the 10-20% supposed gain for what to them was an awkward style, and mainly considered for lwts. <br /><br />But it does work for anyone.

[[old] ljwagner]

<!--QuoteBegin-Coach Gus+Nov 25 2005, 06:04 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Coach Gus @ Nov 25 2005, 06:04 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin-ljwagner+Nov 24 2005, 06:04 AM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(ljwagner @ Nov 24 2005, 06:04 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Crab at the finish, so my hands were in front of my chest already.  <br /> <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />It's statements like this one that are confusing. Is there ever a time when you are rowing that you are rowing correctly when your arms aren't already in front of your chest? A crab at the finish could mean your arms end up above your chest as the oar is on it's way over your head, but I can't figure any other time it would be happening. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />HANDS were in front of the chest (at the finish) on that crab . No I don't think we rowed much with them behind the chest very often.

[[old] ljwagner]

<!--QuoteBegin-John Rupp+Nov 25 2005, 06:39 PM--><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Nov 25 2005, 06:39 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><!--QuoteEBegin-->One of the best examples of this was Rob Waddell, in a few seconds clip as part of a C2 crash b tape.<br /><br />After the catch, his upper body was virtually motionless at the same angle all the way through the drive to the finish. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /><br />No ! Hmm. Another one on the planet ?

[[old] John Rupp]

Jim,<br /><br />I stand corrected.

[[old] John Rupp]

Waddell keeps an upright, slightly forward torso position through the drive.