What Strength Training Have You Done Today

[old] kwadams · Post by **[old] kwadams** » January 31st, 2005, 8:47 pm

Yoda--<br /><br />Since you're looking for some feedback, I thought I'd mention that I'm into week 3 now of SS. I'm liking it so far. No actually, I absolutely hate it, but it's working! I really have to get myself psyched up for a session as it is arguably harder on you mentally than physically. It's amazing how quick you are done with your weight workout (relative to the old 3 set, split routine I used to do); but even more amazing is how it sneaks up on you a few hours after the workout and last for days. <br /><br />Anyway, it's painful, but it's done fairly quickly and enables you to spend more time doing other stuff. Yesterday, I got my first rowing lesson in the tanks at a local college here. Hopefully, I'll be ready to hit the river come spring (whenever that is!).<br /><br />Kevin

[old] gw1 · Post by **[old] gw1** » January 31st, 2005, 9:34 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>But "Golf", that ranks right up there with bowling. Gawd!!!! </td></tr></table><br /><br />No mate you've got it all wrong, firstly with golf the silly shoes are only optional, and secondly its much more of a challenge trying to get that stinking little white ball through the woods over the hills around the sand traps and water and into the hole. If you get the opportunity watch the great standup piece that Robin Williams does on golf and how the game was invented, truly a classic even if you don't play.<br /><br />Cheers<br />GW

[old] Alistair · Post by **[old] Alistair** » February 1st, 2005, 4:40 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(DIESEL @ Jan 31 2005, 08:45 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>P.S. Smith Machine squats aren't real squats The balancing aspect of free squats is what makes them so much better (and nastier) than their Smith cousins. So given what you said - you weren't going as hard as you could have theoretically gone. 3x8 with 150kg deep free squats is much more difficult than 3x8 with 150kg on the Smith machine. And given your rep totals you could have gone much heavier if you tried ! You could have done a proper set at 175kg! <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />And smith machines are not good for squatting, you'll never get me using one for that. They force you to push the weight in an entirely straight line, whereas if you're doing it free the weights arc slightly. It also can incourage bad technique. It's very easy to damage spine and knee joints on a smith machine. Which is a shame, as almost every commercial gym instructor just tells people to use them.<br /><br />Learn how to do it properly with free weights and get a spotter. Better quality workout, better utilisation of supporting muscles and safer.

[old] neilb · Post by **[old] neilb** » February 1st, 2005, 5:06 am

<br />Strength training today was on a stability ball. Kneeling on it may look fairly easy but you actually need good core strength as well as balance. It also recruits the quads and glutes to help with the stability.<br /><br />I tend to sit as upright as possible as this helps maintain good posture and to do so you need to lift the tops of your feet and shins off the ball so you are balanced just on the knees. This requires even greater control from the cre.<br /><br />To make it more interesting I hold a small medicine ball and raise it up with straight arms (but not locked) until it is held in front of me at shoulder level. The additional weight, movement and change in balance point is yet another challenge to stability. You can then progress to slowly move the medicine ball from side to side keeping your arms straight. <br /><br />Today there was someone else at the gym doing similar exercises and so was able to kneel on the ball 3-4 meters apart and throw a small ball back and forth. Sounds easy but try throwing and catching whilst retaining the balance; it works core and upper legs pretty hard. Generally thought I use a wall at the gym to bounce a football off whilst balancing on the stability ball.<br /><br /> cannot imagine that the big guys who are banging heavy weights into the floor to show how strong they are are impressed by my imitation of a performing seal but ball work (and the pilates) most days certainly helps me a lot with core strength and good posture which in turn helps with maintaining a good, smooth and strong rowing stroke.<br /><br />

[old] neilb · Post by **[old] neilb** » February 1st, 2005, 5:24 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Alistair @ Feb 1 2005, 03:40 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(DIESEL @ Jan 31 2005, 08:45 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>P.S. Smith Machine squats aren't real squats The balancing aspect of free squats is what makes them so much better (and nastier) than their Smith cousins. So given what you said - you weren't going as hard as you could have theoretically gone. 3x8 with 150kg deep free squats is much more difficult than 3x8 with 150kg on the Smith machine. And given your rep totals you could have gone much heavier if you tried ! You could have done a proper set at 175kg! <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />And smith machines are not good for squatting, you'll never get me using one for that. They force you to push the weight in an entirely straight line, whereas if you're doing it free the weights arc slightly. It also can incourage bad technique. It's very easy to damage spine and knee joints on a smith machine. Which is a shame, as almost every commercial gym instructor just tells people to use them.<br /><br />Learn how to do it properly with free weights and get a spotter. Better quality workout, better utilisation of supporting muscles and safer. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Alistair,<br /><br />Could not agree more. I find the Smith machine so "artificial" whereas with free squats and deadlifts I can actually feel what is happening and make the adustments necessary to retain good form. As you say it also recruits the very important stablizer muscles more and these are often "neglected" by macine work.<br /><br />The problem is that I have seen few gym instructors who themselves can squat properly and it takes quite a lot of time and practice to learn to do it properly. Also, how often do you see them actually willing to spot for people?<br /><br />I was fortunate in that I was trained by a guy whose sport was weightlifting and who insisted on proper technique. At first I felt a bit silly doing all those reps with just a broom handle, progressing to bar only and then small weights but in the end it was well worth it.<br /><br />It is like erging; you need to put in the basic work on technique, conditioning, muscle efiiciency etc first. If you just hop on and go for the fast stuff from the start you will not attain full potential, may injure yourself and look stupid.<br /><br />My trainer always said that it was easier to teach women proper squat and deadlift technique because they were less interested in the male macho rush to lift as heavy as possible and would concentrate more on the technique. <br />

[old] Ged Musto · Post by **[old] Ged Musto** » February 1st, 2005, 6:58 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(DIESEL @ Jan 31 2005, 03:45 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Ged Musto @ Jan 31 2005, 02:46 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(DIESEL @ Jan 26 2005, 10:57 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(makesureyoudoitright @ Jan 26 2005, 05:03 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Just interested to see who does any training with the legs?<br /><br />I do squats, deadlifts, hamstring curls, calf raises and leg press as part of a once a week leg routine, the only problem is Im finding myself completely unable to erg for a few days after doing it. I can barely walk nevermind hit the erg! Anyone else been having a similar problem? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /><br />Yeah, I squat - but you can't squat heavy and erg. One or the other (probably both) will suffer. I try to leave squatting for my last workout of the week - then take a day off from training. <br /><br />later, <br />D <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Hi Diesel.<br /><br />Good topic this and I am certain this came up in a similar thread back a few years.<br /><br />Back in 1998 I used to deep squat 150kgs + Olympic Bar on the Smith Machine, 3 sets of 8 repetitions, leg incline presses of 375kgs at 3 sets of 6-8 repetitions and I still managed to pull my best ever 2k of 6:26.3.<br /><br />So it can be done...I have been training better than ever in the gym of late and am trying a 2k flat out sometime towards the end of next week, I will keep all of you informed, as I haven't done a competitive 2k for some years now it will be surprising to see how I get on.<br /><br />Keep up the good work all you fellow ergers and weight trainers!!.<br />Ged. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Hi Ged, <br /><br />I think I didn't make myself entirely clear. I should have said you can't squat heavy and erg at optimum capacity the next day, and vice versa.... By heavy I mean 4-6 rep range at a min. 85% of 1 rep max. <br /><br />P.S. Smith Machine squats aren't real squats The balancing aspect of free squats is what makes them so much better (and nastier) than their Smith cousins. So given what you said - you weren't going as hard as you could have theoretically gone. 3x8 with 150kg deep free squats is much more difficult than 3x8 with 150kg on the Smith machine. And given your rep totals you could have gone much heavier if you tried ! You could have done a proper set at 175kg! <br /><br />Anyway, I would be amazed if you were able to hit a PB for the 2k the day after a heavy session of legs. That's what I was getting at. <br /><br />Conversely, it's hard to hit PB on your squat if you're putting in over 100k / week on the erg. <br /><br />One or both will inevitably suffer. You won't lose all your strength, but you will not be at optimum capacity. Does that make any sense? <br /><br />cheers, <br />D <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Hi Diesel.<br /><br />175 kgs...I used to eat those up for breakfast, more in the region of 200kgs in the past..<br /><br />I have looked at the following posts and I have to say that I feel safer to a certain extent these days using the Smith machine...<br /><br />For the members who don't know my entire fitness background I run my own fitness consultancy of which I have had taken various well known celebrities within the film and television industry. I started off powerlifting for Wales about 25 years ago at the age of 16 deadlifting 200kgs and have a vast weight-lifting knowledge, nowadays I focus more on stamina, strength and endurance related competition training ...I have done conventional squats with a spotter (I wouldn't do without them) in excess of pushing 200kgs and that is with a body weight of just 66kgs, my body weight to power ratio far exceeds the normal person, I can still bench press 140kgs, incline leg pushing up to 450kgs but these days I do nearly all my reps on the smith..<br /><br />As far as trying a 2k goes, honestly I am one of these who can jump on the erg without training for weeks and bash out a more than reasonable time, I have proved this on a number of occasions so next weeks will be interesting to say the least.<br /><br />The one thing I will be checking my eye on in particular will be the spm rate, when I done the 6:26 back just over six years ago my spm then was between 48-51, my resting heart rate these days is around the 38 mark and I am in just as good if not better shape now than back then, I have set myself a personal goal, even years after doing my last 2k I know that I can just jump on and do sub 7 with no after effects but we will see until next week.<br /><br />In the meantime Diesel and the fellow ergers, party on.. <br />Ged.

[old] Ged Musto · Post by **[old] Ged Musto** » February 1st, 2005, 7:15 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Ged Musto @ Feb 1 2005, 05:58 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(DIESEL @ Jan 31 2005, 03:45 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Ged Musto @ Jan 31 2005, 02:46 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(DIESEL @ Jan 26 2005, 10:57 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(makesureyoudoitright @ Jan 26 2005, 05:03 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Just interested to see who does any training with the legs?<br /><br />I do squats, deadlifts, hamstring curls, calf raises and leg press as part of a once a week leg routine, the only problem is Im finding myself completely unable to erg for a few days after doing it. I can barely walk nevermind hit the erg! Anyone else been having a similar problem? <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br /><br />Yeah, I squat - but you can't squat heavy and erg. One or the other (probably both) will suffer. I try to leave squatting for my last workout of the week - then take a day off from training. <br /><br />later, <br />D <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Hi Diesel.<br /><br />Good topic this and I am certain this came up in a similar thread back a few years.<br /><br />Back in 1998 I used to deep squat 150kgs + Olympic Bar on the Smith Machine, 3 sets of 8 repetitions, leg incline presses of 375kgs at 3 sets of 6-8 repetitions and I still managed to pull my best ever 2k of 6:26.3.<br /><br />So it can be done...I have been training better than ever in the gym of late and am trying a 2k flat out sometime towards the end of next week, I will keep all of you informed, as I haven't done a competitive 2k for some years now it will be surprising to see how I get on.<br /><br />Keep up the good work all you fellow ergers and weight trainers!!.<br />Ged. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Hi Ged, <br /><br />I think I didn't make myself entirely clear. I should have said you can't squat heavy and erg at optimum capacity the next day, and vice versa.... By heavy I mean 4-6 rep range at a min. 85% of 1 rep max. <br /><br />P.S. Smith Machine squats aren't real squats The balancing aspect of free squats is what makes them so much better (and nastier) than their Smith cousins. So given what you said - you weren't going as hard as you could have theoretically gone. 3x8 with 150kg deep free squats is much more difficult than 3x8 with 150kg on the Smith machine. And given your rep totals you could have gone much heavier if you tried ! You could have done a proper set at 175kg! <br /><br />Anyway, I would be amazed if you were able to hit a PB for the 2k the day after a heavy session of legs. That's what I was getting at. <br /><br />Conversely, it's hard to hit PB on your squat if you're putting in over 100k / week on the erg. <br /><br />One or both will inevitably suffer. You won't lose all your strength, but you will not be at optimum capacity. Does that make any sense? <br /><br />cheers, <br />D <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Hi Diesel.<br /><br />175 kgs...I used to eat those up for breakfast, more in the region of 200kgs in the past..<br /><br />I have looked at the following posts and I have to say that I feel safer to a certain extent these days using the Smith machine...<br /><br />For the members who don't know my entire fitness background I run my own fitness consultancy of which I have had taken various well known celebrities within the film and television industry. I started off powerlifting for Wales about 25 years ago at the age of 16 deadlifting 200kgs and have a vast weight-lifting knowledge, nowadays I focus more on stamina, strength and endurance related competition training ...I have done conventional squats with a spotter (I wouldn't do without them) in excess of pushing 200kgs and that is with a body weight of just 66kgs, my body weight to power ratio far exceeds the normal person, I can still bench press 140kgs, incline leg pushing up to 450kgs but these days I do nearly all my reps on the smith..<br /><br />As far as trying a 2k goes, honestly I am one of these who can jump on the erg without training for weeks and bash out a more than reasonable time, I have proved this on a number of occasions so next weeks will be interesting to say the least.<br /><br />The one thing I will be checking my eye on in particular will be the spm rate, when I done the 6:26 back just over six years ago my spm then was between 48-51, my resting heart rate these days is around the 38 mark and I am in just as good if not better shape now than back then, I have set myself a personal goal, even years after doing my last 2k I know that I can just jump on and do sub 7 with no after effects but we will see until next week.<br /><br />In the meantime Diesel and the fellow ergers, party on.. <br />Ged. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Forgot to mention just in case anyone happens to pick up on it I only do deep squats on the smith and not the incline as it seems from my previous post!<br /><br />

[old] Yoda1 · Post by **[old] Yoda1** » February 1st, 2005, 8:37 am

Kevin,<br /><br />You've got a few weeks into the SS now. So, it's time to watch very closely to your ability to recover. The inroads with SS are very deep. If you notice that you are not recovering as quickly as your earlier workouts with SS, then begin to space the workouts further a part. Instead of once every 4-5 days, make it once every 6-7 days. You get the idea I'm sure.<br /><br />Gary,<br /><br />I will check out Robin Williams stint on "Golf"<br /><br />Neil,<br /><br />You are right about the Stability Ball exercises. I've tried them several times and find that they (the exercises) are a lot like SS. In that they don't seem too hard while trying them, but sneak up on you the next day. I'm not allowed to do any "Ball" exercises in the living room anymore because I continue to knock out lamps, paintings on the wall, and other items on tables. That ball will shoot a long way when you fall off. Have you tried using straps or tubing to exercise while kneeling on the ball?<br /><br />Yoda

[old] neilb · Post by **[old] neilb** » February 1st, 2005, 3:06 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Yoda1 @ Feb 1 2005, 07:37 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> Have you tried using straps or tubing to exercise while kneeling on the ball?<br /><br />Yoda <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Yoda,<br /><br />Doesn't being strapped to the ball rather defeat the purpose <br /><br />Neil.

[old] DIESEL · Post by **[old] DIESEL** » February 1st, 2005, 4:20 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Ged Musto @ Feb 1 2005, 05:58 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><br /><br />The one thing I will be checking my eye on in particular will be the spm rate, when I done the 6:26 back just over six years ago my spm then was between 48-51, <br />Ged. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Jeez, Ged... 48-51 spm? either you have a really short stroke or you truly are a freak of nature! How do you get it up so fast?<br /><br />damn....<br /><br />D

[old] Yoda1 · Post by **[old] Yoda1** » February 1st, 2005, 5:51 pm

Neil,<br /><br />That <b>WAS</b> good!!! Seriously, I've had some of the folks here tell me about people they have seen doing exercises with straps (flat rubbery peices of latex) and tubes (round rubbery peices of latex) on the ball. I haven't tried cause I'm still trying to stay in the kneeling position for more than about 5 seconds. I don't think it's because I lack core strength, but more because of a balance problem.<br /><br />Yoda

[old] Yoda1 · Post by **[old] Yoda1** » February 1st, 2005, 9:06 pm

GED,<br /><br />Please explain what a press up is.<br /><br />Thank you in advance.<br /><br />Yoda

[old] Porkchop · Post by **[old] Porkchop** » February 1st, 2005, 11:07 pm

"Pressup" = Brit. "Pushup"

[old] neilb · Post by **[old] neilb** » February 2nd, 2005, 3:52 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Yoda1 @ Feb 1 2005, 04:51 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Neil,<br /><br />That <b>WAS</b> good!!! Seriously, I've had some of the folks here tell me about people they have seen doing exercises with straps (flat rubbery peices of latex) and tubes (round rubbery peices of latex) on the ball. I haven't tried cause I'm still trying to stay in the kneeling position for more than about 5 seconds. I don't think it's because I lack core strength, but more because of a balance problem.<br /><br />Yoda <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Yoda,<br /><br />Yes, I know people who use cable cross over machine whilst on a ball but never tried that myself. Sometimes when standing on the ball I will perform squats (no weights!) but I cannot do more than 3 and I find it very hard to get below parallel.<br /><br />When I was learning and attended classes we would sometimes pair off at the end and rather than throw a ball back and forward we would connect up with 2 bands and try and pull the other person off their ball but that requires a very good matching of ability and size (and there were not many 100kg guys who attended!)<br /><br />I sometimes used a flex band stretched across my back for doing twists. I find it helps focus on keeping nice and upright. Another way, and safer if not entirely confident for control, is to hold the band (or a light bar) across your chest. It will again help maintain the upright stance (natural tendency is to tuck forward as it easier to balance then) and it is easier to use the hands/arms to help maintain balance. Once you get comfortable with kneeling then you do need to introduce these different ways to destabilize you so you can carry on developing.<br /><br />I am sure you do not lack core strength and to say "it is a balance problem" is a bit of a cop out. The key for stability on the ball is being able to engage and keep engaged all the muscles and apply them to help correct any shifts in balance. A bit like the really slow heavy squats where you are controlling it all the way down and all the way up and I guess that is not a problem for you. So, just get on there and start using what you have already got! <br /><br />Neil

[old] Ged Musto · Post by **[old] Ged Musto** » February 2nd, 2005, 7:09 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(DIESEL @ Feb 1 2005, 03:20 PM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'><b>QUOTE(Ged Musto @ Feb 1 2005, 05:58 AM)</b></div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><br /><br />The one thing I will be checking my eye on in particular will be the spm rate, when I done the 6:26 back just over six years ago my spm then was between 48-51, <br />Ged. <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Jeez, Ged... 48-51 spm? either you have a really short stroke or you truly are a freak of nature! How do you get it up so fast?<br /><br />damn....<br /><br />D <br /> </td></tr></table><br /><br />Diesel.<br /><br />I have been asked this question on many occasions over the years, how can keep a 48-51 spm up for 6 and half minutes, the truth is I don't really know myself, I am what other pros call me a total freak of nature in relation to my body weight to power ratio is concerned..I always bring the handle up to the chest and go as far as I can with the reach, I have always been strong in the legs and I produce a lot of drive... but I have tried executing the stroke on a slower rate but with more emphasis on the pull but I have not been comfortable with this, so next week I will be going to try what I do best on the machine and just give it a blast! everything to gain and absolutely nothing to lose... <br /><br />Cheers again Diesel.<br />Ged.