Russian Kettlebells

[old] Porkchop · Post by **[old] Porkchop** » July 22nd, 2005, 11:08 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jul 21 2005, 05:55 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Here is a web page for a home made adjustable kettlebell: <a href='http://www.ikettlebell.com/homemadekb.html' target='_blank'>http://www.ikettlebell.com/homemadekb.html</a> <img src='http://www.ikettlebell.com/kb1.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> As compared to this commercial one: <img src='http://www.fractionalplates.com/images/kbells.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> Using the materials from the first one, and the design from the second, can make an improvement to both. For example, the double handle on the commercial one is extraneous, not needed, and only makes the ball more cumbersome. That can be eliminated. Then we end up with a design like this. _T_ </td></tr></table> Actually, John, the double handle is not superfluous, unless you want to limit yourself. In addition to swings, kettlebells are used for movements where you actually flip the KB over to the back of your forearm/wrist at the end of the movement. A "T" design would not allow that. I don't have a dog in this fight, though, because, at least for the time being, I am not planning to get into the kettlebell world. Another option (although I haven't seen these in years) was a kettlebell handle that was used in conjunction with a dumbbell. When I was a kid, the really "fancy" weight sets would include a pair of kettlebell handles like that. I could only afford the basic set though. It was actually a very exciting day when the railway express truck delivered my 110-pound Bruce Randall Mr. Universe iron weight set from Sears back in 1964. I saved for months to come up with the $26 that it cost. Porkchop

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » July 22nd, 2005, 1:27 pm

Dude, I like the exercise. As Cayenne says, there would be much more leverage with having the weight farther away from the hands. I could tell the lack of leverage last night with the hand weight, although it will work well in the meantime. Cayenne, Nice design. Thanks for posting it.

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » July 23rd, 2005, 12:26 am

I went to Home Depot this afternoon and got the following parts: 1 x 3/4" x 9" pipe 2 x 3/4" x 4.5" pipe 1 x 3/4" Tee 1 x 3/4" footer The total cost was $8.61. <img src='http://photobucket.com/albums/y41/johnl ... aster1.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » July 23rd, 2005, 12:36 am

The pipe has some kind of oily crude all over it, that kept getting on my hands. I wiped most of it off and probably should have washed the pipe with something but just wiped it down with some oil and dry paper towels. Then I put the pipes together with some weights, and wrapped the handles with tennis wrap. I didn't want to do any tonight but did a few swings to see how it feels and it's good. With the T and 5x 2.5# plates there is a total of 15 pounds, which feels about right. The weights clack a bit at the top of the swing, so the next step will be to add a collar at the top of the weights. I think it's a good idea to play around with the swings for a week or two, before starting to do anything more consistent with them. This picture is from the pdf file. Mine is more sleek than this. <img src='http://photobucket.com/albums/y41/johnl ... aster2.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />

[old] The Dude Abides · Post by **[old] The Dude Abides** » July 23rd, 2005, 1:19 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Jul 23 2005, 12:36 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>The pipe has some kind of oily crude all over it, that kept getting on my hands. I wiped most of it off and probably should have washed the pipe with something but just wiped it down with some oil and dry paper towels. Then I put the pipes together with some weights, and wrapped the handles with tennis wrap. I didn't want to do any tonight but did a few swings to see how it feels and it's good. With the T and 5x 2.5# plates there is a total of 15 pounds, which feels about right. The weights clack a bit at the top of the swing, so the next step will be to add a collar at the top of the weights. I think it's a good idea to play around with the swings for a week or two, before starting to do anything more consistent with them. This picture is from the pdf file. Mine is more sleek than this. <img src='http://photobucket.com/albums/y41/johnl ... aster2.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> </td></tr></table> Good deal man, looks good ) let me know how it works for you!

[old] tditmar · Post by **[old] tditmar** » July 23rd, 2005, 1:47 am

In my attempt to set up my own personal Crossfit system so I don't need to join a gym (my rational for the spending), I have acquired a number of things. I have a top of the line Olympic weight set with Chapman bar, 140kg Kraiburg Bumper Plates, York curl bar and smaller plates, the easy chin pullup and dip bars with other apparatus, and finally, a set of PowerBlock dumbbells. This is all not to mention my C2 and slides, expensive mountain bike, and various other (some expensive knick knacks for exercise). To be honest, I haven't even set up the Easy Chin stuff, because they require some nails in the doorway and I haven't gotten around to figuring it out. I really want to start getting to some chinups. So now my dilemma and a question. With all this stuff I have purchased in a 2 bedroom city condo with 2 adults and a child, my fiancee is going to KILL me if I buy anything more, and I don't mean that as a euphemism . (A space and $ thing). Especially when I freak out at her $300/month on cosmetics (an actual addiction). She actually insisted that should be considered a household expense and now it is. That is the dilemma. I wouldn't have even become aware of all these things most likely were it not for the internet. Surf around and you sometimes learn too much. And of course it is difficult knowing what is right and what is wrong. Now the question...do I really need kettlebells when I have PowerBlocks? I mean how much of a difference is there? I can and do most of the same exercises. For that matter, what about clubbells as well. They have kind of the same mystique as the kettlebells (old American military training tool as well). I should mention I am 42 and am beginning to believe my fiancee that I am having an early mid-life crisis. I really want them...but do I need them vs what I already have. I would really love to have someone convince me I could get rid of all my weights and use only kettlebells. That would be very freeing in both mind and actual space. Matt Furey recently wrote a letter where he mentioned some guy in a gym challenged him with the bench press saying all the bodyweight exercises were good for was endurance and not absolute strength. Matt claimed it had been quite some time since his last bench press since he gave up weights, but he actually bettered his own record by 20% all of which he attributed to bodyweight exercise. Does anyone believe that could be true?

[old] Porkchop · Post by **[old] Porkchop** » July 23rd, 2005, 9:02 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(tditmar @ Jul 23 2005, 12:47 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>In my attempt to set up my own personal Crossfit system so I don't need to join a gym (my rational for the spending), I have acquired a number of things. I have a top of the line Olympic weight set with Chapman bar, 140kg Kraiburg Bumper Plates, York curl bar and smaller plates, the easy chin pullup and dip bars with other apparatus, and finally, a set of PowerBlock dumbbells. This is all not to mention my C2 and slides, expensive mountain bike, and various other (some expensive knick knacks for exercise). To be honest, I haven't even set up the Easy Chin stuff, because they require some nails in the doorway and I haven't gotten around to figuring it out. I really want to start getting to some chinups. So now my dilemma and a question. With all this stuff I have purchased in a 2 bedroom city condo with 2 adults and a child, my fiancee is going to KILL me if I buy anything more, and I don't mean that as a euphemism . (A space and $ thing). Especially when I freak out at her $300/month on cosmetics (an actual addiction). She actually insisted that should be considered a household expense and now it is. That is the dilemma. I wouldn't have even become aware of all these things most likely were it not for the internet. Surf around and you sometimes learn too much. And of course it is difficult knowing what is right and what is wrong. Now the question...do I really need kettlebells when I have PowerBlocks? I mean how much of a difference is there? I can and do most of the same exercises. For that matter, what about clubbells as well. They have kind of the same mystique as the kettlebells (old American military training tool as well). I should mention I am 42 and am beginning to believe my fiancee that I am having an early mid-life crisis. I really want them...but do I need them vs what I already have. I would really love to have someone convince me I could get rid of all my weights and use only kettlebells. That would be very freeing in both mind and actual space. Matt Furey recently wrote a letter where he mentioned some guy in a gym challenged him with the bench press saying all the bodyweight exercises were good for was endurance and not absolute strength. Matt claimed it had been quite some time since his last bench press since he gave up weights, but he actually bettered his own record by 20% all of which he attributed to bodyweight exercise. Does anyone believe that could be true? </td></tr></table> Tditmar, You really have four issues to resolve: Space, relationship, financial, and goal. "Need" is a relative term. Your fiancee says that wanting to stay in shape is a midlife crisis? Ask her just how long she wants you to be there for her. Fitness is a lifetime thing. Presumably, she would like to defer the "death do us part" element of marriage for as long as possible. Whether you "need" kettlebells to stay fit is a separate question, though, which relates more to what kind of fitness you want to maintain. If you want to follow Crossfit to the letter, then you "need" them, but Crossfit allows and encourages substitutions when equipment is lacking. If we bought everything that is ever suggested on Crossfit, the home gym would quickly outgrow most homes. I put kettlebells in the "nice to have" category. I can do without them for a long time -- I'd rather buy additional dumbbells to increase my collection. (They didn't make Powerblocks when I started, so I have a LOT of hex dumbbells.) If you intend to do a lot of kettlebell-style movements, though, I do wonder whether Powerblocks can be held appropriately for two-handed movements. Can you get rid of everything else and use only kettlebells? I don't think that even Pavel himself would tell you that -- Power to the People is not about kettlebells, it is about barbells. The question is not whether kettlebells would sub for everything else, it is whether kettlebell work is what you want to do in lieu of everything else. My sense is that if you want to follow a Crossfit-type routine, then kettlebells are an add-on, not a substitute. In any event, this is probably not the place to ask the question. You should probably post this on the Crossfit equipment forum. The folks over there are in a much better position to answer your questions about equipment priorities for their program. Matt Furey says a lot of things, mostly for the purpose of convincing you to contribute to the Keep Matt Furey Living High on the Hog Fund. He started out with a solid program (Combat Conditioning) and then went off the deep end, in my opinion. There is no question that you could sell all of your gym equipment, do nothing but bodyweight exercises, and maintain some kind of physical conditioning that many people would find to be excellent -- military fitness programs are an example. The question is whether that is the kind of physical conditioning you are after. Matt Furey's programs are demanding, and they work, but they are also boring as can be and once you get past his basic stuff, they are incredibly expensive just for the programs. Now, I have a question: How do the condo neighbors feel about you doing Oly lifts in your condo? I would think that bumper plates hitting the floor after a snatch or C&J would be pretty annoying to the folks below you. Porkchop

[old] tditmar · Post by **[old] tditmar** » July 23rd, 2005, 12:40 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Porkchop @ Jul 23 2005, 08:02 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>You really have four issues to resolve: Space, relationship, financial, and goal. "Need" is a relative term. Your fiancee says that wanting to stay in shape is a midlife crisis? Ask her just how long she wants you to be there for her. Fitness is a lifetime thing. Presumably, she would like to defer the "death do us part" element of marriage for as long as possible. Whether you "need" kettlebells to stay fit is a separate question, though, which relates more to what kind of fitness you want to maintain. If you want to follow Crossfit to the letter, then you "need" them, but Crossfit allows and encourages substitutions when equipment is lacking. If we bought everything that is ever suggested on Crossfit, the home gym would quickly outgrow most homes. I put kettlebells in the "nice to have" category. I can do without them for a long time -- I'd rather buy additional dumbbells to increase my collection. (They didn't make Powerblocks when I started, so I have a LOT of hex dumbbells.) If you intend to do a lot of kettlebell-style movements, though, I do wonder whether Powerblocks can be held appropriately for two-handed movements. Can you get rid of everything else and use only kettlebells? I don't think that even Pavel himself would tell you that -- Power to the People is not about kettlebells, it is about barbells. The question is not whether kettlebells would sub for everything else, it is whether kettlebell work is what you want to do in lieu of everything else. My sense is that if you want to follow a Crossfit-type routine, then kettlebells are an add-on, not a substitute. In any event, this is probably not the place to ask the question. You should probably post this on the Crossfit equipment forum. The folks over there are in a much better position to answer your questions about equipment priorities for their program. Matt Furey says a lot of things, mostly for the purpose of convincing you to contribute to the Keep Matt Furey Living High on the Hog Fund. He started out with a solid program (Combat Conditioning) and then went off the deep end, in my opinion. There is no question that you could sell all of your gym equipment, do nothing but bodyweight exercises, and maintain some kind of physical conditioning that many people would find to be excellent -- military fitness programs are an example. The question is whether that is the kind of physical conditioning you are after. Matt Furey's programs are demanding, and they work, but they are also boring as can be and once you get past his basic stuff, they are incredibly expensive just for the programs. Now, I have a question: How do the condo neighbors feel about you doing Oly lifts in your condo? I would think that bumper plates hitting the floor after a snatch or C&J would be pretty annoying to the folks below you. Porkchop </td></tr></table> Porkchop, Thanks for the comments. Yeah you are probably right, wrong forum, but since the topic was kettlebells, and I am interested in them, I wondered if someone could describe the physiological difference in writing between them and say dumbbells of which my happen to be PowerBlocks. You are also correct about the issues, and that is what I am having trouble sorting out. I guess my goal is more along the lines of what I have read in the Crossfit journal. You know, wellness vs fitness. I guess I want to be strong and fast, but also to have good endurance. My fiancee doesn't have a clue how much time and effort some put into working out, she would go nuts with some of them. I often go over a week doing nothing because I get so busy and then try to get back into it. When I recently insisted I needed to erg after work or go for a run, she commented I would never get in the way of your "vain" time. I gotta admit, besides being a pain in the a** she is pretty funny. Then another issue is I think I am beginning to feel a bit like the spoiled children I can't stand, buying everything I see because suddenly I think I need it. I still remember the kid in my neighborhood growing up whose parents bought him the latest of everything despite his need and skill level. The ugliness of that stays with you. I am currently fighting that battle with a 13 yr old and I dont want her to get confused. I suppose there is a certain amount of guilt involved and I search for rational. I just read these reviews on the book you mentioned, <a href='http://sfuk.tripod.com/reviews/pavel_pttp.html' target='_blank'>http://sfuk.tripod.com/reviews/pavel_pttp.html</a>, <a href='http://www.tc.umn.edu/~keen0018/ptp.htm' target='_blank'>http://www.tc.umn.edu/~keen0018/ptp.htm</a> and what I like is how easy it makes it sound and how little it appears you have to seemingly put into it. Now I want to keep the barbells again. I have been to the Dragon Door and Dolfzine sites quite often so you can imagine how confused one can get. By the way, ever see this article <a href='http://www.dolfzine.com/page459.htm' target='_blank'>http://www.dolfzine.com/page459.htm</a> Who do you believe?! I have also printed out entire old weightlifting books from <a href='http://www.sandowplus.co.uk/Competition ... .htm#klein' target='_blank'>http://www.sandowplus.co.uk/Competition ... ein</a> And, Oh I have padding under the barbells and I assist more than I should in the drop. So far so good. I looked into building a platform, but that is really a lot of work and would be difficult here. They sell them at York, but they are quite expensive for their purpose, and I would need more space. Perhaps one day I will not live in the city and have a garage I can use. I guess the jist of all this is I want to be strong and fast with great endurance (crossfit) and I want to do it as efficiently as possible, meaning using as little time, space, and equipment as necessary.

[old] Cayenne · Post by **[old] Cayenne** » July 23rd, 2005, 4:50 pm

John, As I have and use and enjoy the "core blaster" with parts from Home Depot, ( +/- 40 lbs. on it, ) please let me know the specs on the collar that you pick up to reduce the clanging. It certainly is a (relatively,) minor detail, but why not address it, especially for a .47 cent part ? BTW, this brings to mind to details of what I understand to be good swing form. 1. Re: The Clanging; When one swings the weight, the weight is projected outward. Power is from hip thrust, through the body, through the arms, which are NOT lifting but are "cables" holding the KB or Blaster. If projected to chest height, virtually no clang. Above that, yes, clang. 2. The entire movement may be thought of as a vertical jump wherein the feet do not leave the ground and the power "leaves" through the extended arms. (However, I keep the scapula retracted rather than being round shouldered, to maintain good posture and form.) Of course, abdominal bracing and sphincter lock play a role as well, but I'll leave that for another post, or another poster Funny, like rowing, a simple movement pattern, but so much to consider to approach, ( but never attain,) the "perfect" swing. Stay strong, Eddie

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » July 24th, 2005, 12:20 am

Eddie, I put a collar on the pipe tonight and it works very well. The collar is from a hand weight, using the hex screw but minus the usual lever. Tightening with a hex wrench allows the collar to snug right up to the plates.

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » July 24th, 2005, 11:46 am

Here is a picture of my core blaster. <img src='http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y41/jo ... ster4b.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> This is with 5x 2.5# weights and the 2.5# frame, for a total of 15 pounds. Notice the collar at the top of the weights, the footer at the bottom, and the wrapping on the handle. This might be a little light so I'll likely go to 20# as I get used to the exercise.

[old] akit110 · Post by **[old] akit110** » July 25th, 2005, 12:17 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(tditmar @ Jul 23 2005, 01:47 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>In my attempt to set up my own personal Crossfit system so I don't need to join a gym (my rational for the spending), I have acquired a number of things. I have a top of the line Olympic weight set with Chapman bar, 140kg Kraiburg Bumper Plates, York curl bar and smaller plates, the easy chin pullup and dip bars with other apparatus, and finally, a set of PowerBlock dumbbells. This is all not to mention my C2 and slides, expensive mountain bike, and various other (some expensive knick knacks for exercise). To be honest, I haven't even set up the Easy Chin stuff, because they require some nails in the doorway and I haven't gotten around to figuring it out. I really want to start getting to some chinups. So now my dilemma and a question. With all this stuff I have purchased in a 2 bedroom city condo with 2 adults and a child, my fiancee is going to KILL me if I buy anything more, and I don't mean that as a euphemism . (A space and $ thing). Especially when I freak out at her $300/month on cosmetics (an actual addiction). She actually insisted that should be considered a household expense and now it is. That is the dilemma. I wouldn't have even become aware of all these things most likely were it not for the internet. Surf around and you sometimes learn too much. And of course it is difficult knowing what is right and what is wrong. Now the question...do I really need kettlebells when I have PowerBlocks? I mean how much of a difference is there? I can and do most of the same exercises. For that matter, what about clubbells as well. They have kind of the same mystique as the kettlebells (old American military training tool as well). I should mention I am 42 and am beginning to believe my fiancee that I am having an early mid-life crisis. I really want them...but do I need them vs what I already have. I would really love to have someone convince me I could get rid of all my weights and use only kettlebells. That would be very freeing in both mind and actual space. Matt Furey recently wrote a letter where he mentioned some guy in a gym challenged him with the bench press saying all the bodyweight exercises were good for was endurance and not absolute strength. Matt claimed it had been quite some time since his last bench press since he gave up weights, but he actually bettered his own record by 20% all of which he attributed to bodyweight exercise. Does anyone believe that could be true? </td></tr></table> I got to think there's a huge novelty factor involved in the resurgence of interest in kettlebells, Indian clubs, bodyweight exercises and other exercises and equipment mostly supplanted by the modern adjustable dumbbell or barbell about the time by grandfather was a young man. Novelty is not necessarily a bad thing - and a new training tool with a renewed enthusiasm for training can result in real gains. But there is also a marketing element to all of this. If someone was to offer a simple dumbbell course on the internet, he/she would barely be able to give it away, but talk about such now forgotten physical culture esoterica as Indian clubs or kettlebells, and you develop a lot of interest and sell a lot of (expensive) equipment and instructional DVDs and books. I think the internet is dangerous for people for us equipment 'nerds' as we can read up on all sorts of cool things that we would never come across in daily life or at the local mega sports store. It becomes very tempting to get that next piece of equipment that promises to transform us to the next level.

[old] Yoda1 · Post by **[old] Yoda1** » July 26th, 2005, 10:36 pm

I wonder why no one has asked the question---What's the difference between Russian Kettlebells and American Kettlebells? Or for that matter what's the difference between Russian, American, French, and Japanese Kettlebells? John, don't answer these questions. You'll probably try to tell me they were invented by Kettle. Gawd, I love this. Yoda

[old] Porkchop · Post by **[old] Porkchop** » July 26th, 2005, 10:54 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Yoda1 @ Jul 26 2005, 09:36 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I wonder why no one has asked the question---What's the difference between Russian Kettlebells and American Kettlebells? Or for that matter what's the difference between Russian, American, French, and Japanese Kettlebells? John, don't answer these questions. You'll probably try to tell me they were invented by Kettle. Gawd, I love this. Yoda </td></tr></table> The foreign kettlebells talk with funny accents, like you, Yoda, but different. They are different colors, too -- Jedi kettlebells are green.

[old] kwadams · Post by **[old] kwadams** » July 27th, 2005, 7:52 am

Yoda-- I was wondering when you were going to get in on the action! How's your summer going...staying out of the heat or are you still doing your daily hike up the mountain? It's been hard for me to stay inside so I've been putting in a lot of miles on my road bike and hitting the weights 2-3 times a week. I wouldn't mind giving up the weights almost completely as my joints are bugging me (I know, back to Super Slow I go). How are those new shoulders holding up? Are you still using that Total Trainer gym? Oh, and I've been rowing a bit on the river here, since this is a rowing site after all! Take care, Kevin

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