How To Improve 2k Time

[old] Sentinal93 · Post by **[old] Sentinal93** » November 2nd, 2005, 8:11 pm

I'm always looking to improve my 2k time, but aren't we all? My issue is that I'm unsure of what training will help me improve the most. I feel like my times are not balanced. To give you an idea of how I do on my pieces, here are my recent times for the following pieces: 2k = 6:24 5k = 16:48 6k = 20:18 10k = 34:36 hour = 17038m I'm assuming I'm more of a distance rower, although I feel like i'm not pulling my potential for the 2k. I weigh about 178 pounds/81Kilos, and I'm 6'3''/1.9meters, and I don't have as much upper body strength as lower. My three thoughts on how to improve are: 1. Do weight training, focusing on upper body 2. Do more sprint work 3. Just pull harder, and I'm just wimping out the intensity of the 2k What does everyone think? Also, what techniques has anyone used to improve their 2k? Are my times disproportionate? If so, how much? -Eric Di Bari UAlbany Crew

[old] Ray79 · Post by **[old] Ray79** » November 2nd, 2005, 8:32 pm

Eric, I think that the only real way to improve your Ergo times is with time on the ergo. However obvious this sounds. Lifting weights will of course help in the longer run by increasing your strength, but its application of this on the ergo through improvement of your strength-endurance that will reduce your times and this can only be gained by practice. Which means........yep you guessed it.......lots of metres on the ergo. There are a couple of trains of thought on ways to improve your 2 km time. And there are some good discussions on both on this and the uk forum. The first way is to use interval training such as the 8x500m with 3.30 mins rest between each one. This is a massive challenge to your CV system, especially keeping your times for each interval consistent. Something I failed to do the first couple of times I tried it, I just completly blew up after about number 5. The second is longer distance, slow rate rowing such as the 30mins @ Rate 20. This is one of my favorite rows as it takes alot of concentration and requires you to really hook on at the catch and drive with the legs to keep your 500m splits down. And i believe there is some correlation between the distance you can do in this and your 2 km time. There are a range of different calculators for these things on this site <a href='http://www.machars.net/spi.php' target='_blank'>http://www.machars.net/spi.php</a> There are other plans around incorporating different workouts focusing on different aspects of rowing. They include pyramid sessions and different interval sessions (4x 1km, 4x 750m etc). My advice would be to do a search on here or on the UK forum ( <a href='http://www.concept2.co.uk/forum/index.php' target='_blank'>http://www.concept2.co.uk/forum/index.php</a> ), have a good read at some of the things people are doing and formulate a plan that you think will suit you. All the best and Happy Rowing

[old] SkipD · Post by **[old] SkipD** » November 2nd, 2005, 8:32 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Sentinal93 @ Nov 2 2005, 07:11 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I'm always looking to improve my 2k time, but aren't we all? My issue is that I'm unsure of what training will help me improve the most. I feel like my times are not balanced. To give you an idea of how I do on my pieces, here are my recent times for the following pieces: 2k = 6:24 5k = 16:48 6k = 20:18 10k = 34:36 hour = 17038m I'm assuming I'm more of a distance rower, although I feel like i'm not pulling my potential for the 2k. I weigh about 178 pounds/81Kilos, and I'm 6'3''/1.9meters, and I don't have as much upper body strength as lower. My three thoughts on how to improve are: 1. Do weight training, focusing on upper body 2. Do more sprint work 3. Just pull harder, and I'm just wimping out the intensity of the 2k What does everyone think? Also, what techniques has anyone used to improve their 2k? Are my times disproportionate? If so, how much? -Eric Di Bari UAlbany Crew </td></tr></table>

[old] Ray79 · Post by **[old] Ray79** » November 2nd, 2005, 8:43 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Sentinal93 @ Nov 2 2005, 07:11 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'> Are my times disproportionate? If so, how much? </td></tr></table> Sorry, missed this bit I dont think your times are disproportionate for someone of your height and build. But then these things also tend to depend on how long you have been rowing etc. Your average splits seem to be fairly evenly spread over the distances you quoted. Its always good to remember that the 2km is an all out distance and that any improvement is not to be ignored, even if it is only a couple of seconds.

[old] Carl Henrik · Post by **[old] Carl Henrik** » November 3rd, 2005, 3:55 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Sentinal93 @ Nov 3 2005, 12:11 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I'm always looking to improve my 2k time, but aren't we all? My issue is that I'm unsure of what training will help me improve the most. I feel like my times are not balanced. To give you an idea of how I do on my pieces, here are my recent times for the following pieces: 2k = 6:24 5k = 16:48 6k = 20:18 10k = 34:36 hour = 17038m I'm assuming I'm more of a distance rower, although I feel like i'm not pulling my potential for the 2k. I weigh about 178 pounds/81Kilos, and I'm 6'3''/1.9meters, and I don't have as much upper body strength as lower. My three thoughts on how to improve are: 1. Do weight training, focusing on upper body 2. Do more sprint work 3. Just pull harder, and I'm just wimping out the intensity of the 2k What does everyone think? Also, what techniques has anyone used to improve their 2k? Are my times disproportionate? If so, how much? -Eric Di Bari UAlbany Crew </td></tr></table> Hi Eric, You seem to be a "double the d add three"-person. Some people are like that, meaning they get great distance scores in comparison to 2k. If you want to check wether you are just being wimpy on the 2k I recommend doing 4x1ks at 2k pace weekly. Start slightly below 2k wattage and try to improve by 1w every week.

[old] csabour · Post by **[old] csabour** » November 3rd, 2005, 6:57 pm

it sounds to me like you have some sort of bottleneck on your 2k... I think i have a similar problem... first you have to isolate to problem. for instance: For me i saw that my legs burnt out first and by the bottom 500 i had serious difficulty getting up the slide let alone bringing it up for a sprint... my remedy has been to work on keeping the lactate overload low in my legs. I used interval training and jump squats. by putting my legs in the position where it needed to deal with more lactate than normal several times in a workout. by the end of the day, my body was couping with it better and so when testing comes along i can push not harder, but longer. there are many articles you can find on the internet and rowing news mag on interval training. however this only worked for me, everyone is different. but it seems to me that because your quads are by far the most powerful muscles of your body and by far the most important in rowing then i recommend you increase the frequency of your interval training. simple stuff. 5x750 2 splits below race pace is a good one. with 7m rest time in between.

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » November 3rd, 2005, 8:15 pm

Csabour, How do you do your jump squats, how many and how often?

[old] PaulS · Post by **[old] PaulS** » November 3rd, 2005, 10:29 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Sentinal93 @ Nov 2 2005, 04:11 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I'm always looking to improve my 2k time, but aren't we all? My issue is that I'm unsure of what training will help me improve the most. I feel like my times are not balanced. To give you an idea of how I do on my pieces, here are my recent times for the following pieces: 2k = 6:24 5k = 16:48 6k = 20:18 10k = 34:36 hour = 17038m I'm assuming I'm more of a distance rower, although I feel like i'm not pulling my potential for the 2k. I weigh about 178 pounds/81Kilos, and I'm 6'3''/1.9meters, and I don't have as much upper body strength as lower. My three thoughts on how to improve are: 1. Do weight training, focusing on upper body 2. Do more sprint work 3. Just pull harder, and I'm just wimping out the intensity of the 2k What does everyone think? Also, what techniques has anyone used to improve their 2k? Are my times disproportionate? If so, how much? -Eric Di Bari UAlbany Crew </td></tr></table> Do you have 1k and 500m times? On first glance it looks like you have super CV endurance and could use some work on power production. Do you have the associated Stroke rates for your above times?

[old] Sentinal93 · Post by **[old] Sentinal93** » November 4th, 2005, 12:35 am

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(PaulS @ Nov 3 2005, 09:29 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(Sentinal93 @ Nov 2 2005, 04:11 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>I'm always looking to improve my 2k time, but aren't we all? My issue is that I'm unsure of what training will help me improve the most. I feel like my times are not balanced. To give you an idea of how I do on my pieces, here are my recent times for the following pieces: 2k = 6:24 5k = 16:48 6k = 20:18 10k = 34:36 hour = 17038m I'm assuming I'm more of a distance rower, although I feel like i'm not pulling my potential for the 2k. I weigh about 178 pounds/81Kilos, and I'm 6'3''/1.9meters, and I don't have as much upper body strength as lower. My three thoughts on how to improve are: 1. Do weight training, focusing on upper body 2. Do more sprint work 3. Just pull harder, and I'm just wimping out the intensity of the 2k What does everyone think? Also, what techniques has anyone used to improve their 2k? Are my times disproportionate? If so, how much? -Eric Di Bari UAlbany Crew </td></tr></table> Do you have 1k and 500m times? On first glance it looks like you have super CV endurance and could use some work on power production. Do you have the associated Stroke rates for your above times? </td></tr></table> My best time for 500m is about 1:27.8, 1k is about 3:06. Although I never give too much attention to stroke rate, these are the ones i feel comfortable with during teh piece and tend to fall into: 500m - 38+ 1k and 2k - 35-38 5k and 6k - 29-30 10k - 28 hour - 27-28 -Eric

[old] hjs · Post by **[old] hjs** » November 4th, 2005, 9:32 am

Your weight lenght is to low. I think you could gain an lt on your 2 k if you could manage to get your strengt up. my former pb is 6.14 with a 20.17 on the 6 k and a 2.56 on the 1 k. My advive would be. lower your overal training km. gain strengt/muscle. so do squats, deadlifts, backpulls. get a good trainer on this field. A important factor is also your way of eating. S get help on that field to. A good training for the 2 k is doing 10/12 times a 300 meters with 1 minuut rest. You should row 3/5 sec faster dan your 2 k 500 splits. succes.

[old] hjs · Post by **[old] hjs** » November 4th, 2005, 9:34 am

I read you should do jumpsquats. Don't do them, very risky for your back. only now I see your strokerate, those are high on every distance. It's for sure lack off strenght in my opinion.

[old] DIESEL · Post by **[old] DIESEL** » November 4th, 2005, 12:28 pm

I'm in agreement with the thought that extra strength in the gym won't translate directly to the erg. If you want to be fast on the erg, you gotta erg, period. Even if you wanted to bulk up, it's too late to do it now during the season - the caloric demands of rowing training (especially winter training) are going to eat up whatever gains you would try to put on. Unless you are willing to up your calorie intake to over 6Kcals / day, it's not happening. Best bet: bulk up in the next offseason and do some erging to keep base fitness and even then it'll probably take you next season to get used to the new weight. I figure it wouldn't really 'click' until the 2007 season. for now - It would seem that WP style training would do wonders for you. take your 2k avg. split and plug it into the progressions and see how your power output stacks up at the lower ratings. From what you've posted, I think you're going to struggle, as it looks like you've been trading rate for pace. It'll suck at first, but once you make the adjustment, your scores will start to drop. good luck, D

[old] John Rupp · Post by **[old] John Rupp** » November 4th, 2005, 1:01 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(hjs @ Nov 4 2005, 05:32 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>do squats, deadlifts, backpulls. [right] </td></tr></table> What are back pulls? I agree that strength training can make a major difference to erg times for short distances. When I first got the erg, a friend of mine came over who weighed 140 pounds and had been working out a lot on a nautilus machine. I told him to take it easy to get used to the movement. He got on and went like a banshee at 1:28 for 30 seconds and was flying all over the place. I thought he was going to pull the machine apart. He didn't do any more after that but was certainly very strong to go faster.

[old] csabour · Post by **[old] csabour** » November 4th, 2005, 1:34 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Nov 3 2005, 07:15 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>Csabour, How do you do your jump squats, how many and how often? </td></tr></table> john, legs are apart like your shoulders. hands out infront. keeping back dead straight. lower your butt until your quads are (80-110) degrees from the ground. kick off explosively get off the ground (just a few inches). down and repeat. stay focused on keeping back straight. reps really depend on your tolorance for lactate. your weight. and the purpose of the work out. in the winter we peak at 2 sets of 200. however you REALLY need to work towards that. last time i did the workout was pre henley with the crew. we peaked at 2 x 100 good compression jump squats.

[old] hjs · Post by **[old] hjs** » November 4th, 2005, 4:17 pm

<table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(John Rupp @ Nov 4 2005, 06:01 PM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><div class='genmed'>QUOTE(hjs @ Nov 4 2005, 05:32 AM)</div></td></tr><tr><td class='quote'>do squats, deadlifts, backpulls. [right] </td></tr></table> What are back pulls? I agree that strength training can make a major difference to erg times for short distances. When I first got the erg, a friend of mine came over who'd been working out a lot on a nautilus machine. I told him to take it easy to get used to the movement. He got on and went like a banshee at 1:28 for 30 seconds and was flying all over the place. I thought he was going to pull the machine apart. He didn't do any more after that but was certainly very strong to go faster. </td></tr></table> backpulls : sitting with your leggs in front and feet on a platform en making the rowpull. Keep the repetitions between 8/12 with good form and keep your back straight. If you really want to become stronger keep the repitions on the low. If you you go higher you train just your lactate system. I think you should do that only on the erg. A jumpsquat as discrepted above is not wat a wat a was warning you about. A was more thinking of that exercise with extra weights. Don't do that.

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